Fishing Reports. How Do You Feel About Them?

[scel]

I have been thinking about this for a while, so I have a lot to say about it...

 

I am kind of torn on river/angling reports. I would like to know what you think of them. When is it OK to write a report? When should someone just keep their mouth shut and appreciate the resource?

 

On one hand, when I was learning (always something to learn...but you know what I mean), river reports were invaluable. I understand that ‘making it easy’ takes away something special from fly fishing. But in my 10 years in advanced adult education, I also know that ‘fighting to learn’ can be destructive. Putting a steep learning curve on anything promotes elitism. Fine. I admit it. I believe fly fishing is better, simply because there is so much to learn. I love learning. I am totally OK with self-directed learning and exploration. But for some things, I still needed a push to increase my enjoyment and appreciation. I did not have a mentor, or even a friend to fishing with me---river reports did this for me, gave me that push.

 

I post river reports when I fish the Bow every 7th or 8th time I go. I still read the river reports all the time, so I think that it is important to occasionally contribute. This Bow river runs through the middle of a city of a million people. Concrete trout line the walls of one our busiest freeways. All in all, there are not many ‘secrets’. There are still places that harbour a higher amount of fish, but everyone seems to understand that you have to earn this knowledge. While there are certainly troubles and inconsistencies (ahem...dam(n) management), I feel the Bow represents a relatively stable ecosystem. I feel the fish are hardy, robust, and, at least compared to east-slope streams, can handle the inevitable mistakes of novice anglers. The Bow is also an environment where the experienced and newly-eager can mingle. The B ow is not an easy river to learn, even if someone tells you exactly what to do. I know people often come to messageboards for quick information. The brutal truth is there is no quick way to learn how to learn how to fish the Bow. For example, even with a precise river report like, “size 18 BWO on typical baetis weather---you will average double digits. Just fish the seams 50m upstream of the trainbridge”. Besides the hordes of people snapping it by the train bridge, fishing teeny BWO takes a lot of practice and finesse. At least people have an outlet to learn. And the girl/guy who finally ‘gets it’, will move a long distance from the trainbridge. All in all the Bow river is a good place to learn about fly fishing. Hopefully, people take the skills they have learned here, and treat those special out-of-the way places with a little more respect and reverence. And that respect is often shared through the Bow River Reports thread.

 

I fished Crawling Valley Reservoir a couple of nights ago. It was on the water for about 6 hours. It took me 3 hours to find my first fish. There are times when the bite is off, but this did not ‘feel’ like one of those times. It was sunny with blustery conditions. I was on the windswept side of the lake. These are usually good pike conditions. I found a cell signal and found a depth map for the Crawling Valley. I heard had great structure, but I had no idea how varied and diverse the lake structure is. It is much more like a Canadian Shield lake than your typical Albertan pothole. I put on a heavier sink tip and retargeted my approach. I caught my first pike, cross referenced depth and weed growth with overall visible structure. And then I started catching many pike. And when the sun started going down, I started catching walleye (a couple over 20”) and bigger pike (this is a good sign, because the biggest pike will follow walleye feeding patterns). Overall, my success took a culmination of all my experience. I had earn my learning. I never encountered anyone else all day. It was almost a perfect day fly fishing. I couldn’t wait to write a report.

 

And then I got home. My Smeagol turned all Gollum. It was my precious lake. I learned the secrets. It was mine. I did not want to share it...

 

But then I stopped to think about it. CVR is potentially one of those reasonable areas where the structure and lake size make it just difficult enough to fish, but also gives lots of opportunities. With the regulations being catch and release for all pike and walleye, it will potentiate the good breeders (and good food sources to make big fish) will stay alive to build a healthy fishery. With increased pressure and environmental sensitivity on the east-slope streams, pike and walleye fishing are slightly more insulated.

 

Congratulations if you made it this far...

 

My feeling is post the occasional report on any major river: Bow, North Saskatchewan, Lower Oldman, Lower Red Deer (below Dickson). Leave tributaries and small streams out of it. Post reports on stillwater stocked/catch and release fisheries, but leave the sensitive ones out (like high alpine lakes) or notably recovering native populations.

[BowLurker]

 

".....And then I got home. My Smeagol turned all Gollum. It was my precious lake. I learned the secrets. It was mine. I did not want to share it..."

 

scel, I won't re-post all your eloquent words, but I can totally relate to this particular line.

 

I'm new to the amazing art of fly fishing, and I learn many new things every day, partially because of trial & error, but also because of online resources such as FFC. ( For example, I had no idea this Forum has been around for so long! )

 

I am also learning without a mentor, or casting buddy, so I can also relate. I'm sure the local fly shops are sick of my constant questions!

 

When I started to figure out a little 1000M stretch of the side-channel at SHP, I was torn between telling all because I was so stoked, but also holding a few cards close. Then, of course, I watch a seasoned side-channel angler wade his arse off across river, catch 5 in succession and shrug his shoulders when I get yet another wind knot!

 

I also agree with the occasional report, especially if it's somewhere unique, or if one is able to get pictures. My thoughts are similar to yours about having just enough difficulty at any spot to make it interesting. I hope that there are still places out there that are 'anonymous' clearwater streams, or bangin' stillwater... maybe most of us still have a few cards left.

 

Thanks scel.

 

-M.

 

 

 

[Smitty]

Nice post Scel.

Of course, this is an age old question; who polices it then? Who decides what is appropriate or not when it comes to the issue "hotspotting" when it really is subjective. Stauffer is small water...but famous? Is that allowed? Who decides? We live in an information age, and information is readily accessible. Pretty tough to restrict it nowadays. It really is up to the individual ethos of every angler. I generally don't post many reports anymore. And if I do, I, like you, don't mention spots unless they are famous, but that judgement is as arbitrary and subjective as the next guy.

As for the issue of the learning curve and "earning" it, well I have a slightly different take, perhaps. I'm all for beginners asking for or seeking help and getting it. I am not referring to merely holding the newbies hand and coddling them forever and not making them "earn" it, but pointing them in the right direction in terms of casting, flies, and yes, some more well known spots to go is not over the line. And the info is already there anyways. But yes, I do resent sometimes, the first question out of someone's mouth (before they congratulate you or thank you or show any modicum of appreciation) is " Where didja catch it?" . Yeesh.

However, let me put it a different way; all of us of the older generation like or cling to the rosy picture of "having to earn it" the old fashioned way and put our time on the water before the dawn of the internet and the information age. Kinda like the "I walked uphill both ways in 4 foot snowdrifts just to get to school" type attitude. Well...oh really? Devil's advocate here; the fly-fishing community likes to brag about having authored more books for our hobby than every other sport; or the common quote goes. So...don't think Lee Wulff or Roderick Haig Brown learned from others, or read some books? They were newbies once. What about Brooks, Whitlock, Kauffman, Kreh, and others? Of course, lots of them broke new ground and were innovators, but my point is that information sharing has been going on a long, long time. Well before the internet turned into jet speed instant gratification. Everyone was a newbie once.

Of course the internet info sharing has proved problematic; look at how the spin guys jealously guard their jumbo perch spots from the "hordes". lol.

Anyways, good topic, not always an easy issue. There are still people that lose their minds over the mention of the holy virgin mother's river, but I think that cat has left the bag.

Next week I am taking 2 beginners to my "secret" spring creek. Don't know if that's a responsible choice. Don't know if I'll blatantly just ask them to keep it a secret. I just might; I just might bring up this conversation and ask them to respect the "code". Lol.

But yeah, I am not speaking about it online, that's for sure!

[trailhead]

This is a very interesting subject. Me I believe in sharing, I was raised that way in a big family. Which also taught me that everyone finds their space. I have taken many novice anglers to my secret streams and they were all grateful. But I have found that in the majority of cases they did not return where we went. I have found that people tend to gravitate to where they have experienced success on their own terms. So when someone posts a glowing report, `the river is on fire the stones are coming off in droves and the fish are gorging, if you throw a size 6 sofa pillow they`ll inhale it:. Then the masses descend and for the most part have limited success. Because the poster was there at that time and had a uniquely surreal experience. It is as was mentioned when you find that spot and figure out what will take fish, you get that sense of accomplishment that is hard to beat. I have encountered anglers on various rivers while having a good day and ask how they are doing and sometimes they say, Nothing happening. If they ask how I`m doing I am truthful and if they ask what I`m using I will tell them. This doesn't mean that they will be successful because my parachute adams might not be like theirs, or it might but my technique is different that theirs. I do this because when I was a relatively new angler back in the early eighties I was fishing a west central lake, I wasn t catching anything and there was a older gentleman catching fish after fish. I asked him what he was using and he said a fly. So I asked what kind and he graciously replied. The one on the end of my line. Nice! So I post most of my trips, If it`s a small stream I won`t give the name, if it`s a bigger river I won`t give the location. I think that encouragement is the best way to promote my passion. The more the merrier and I have also noticed that this pastime does have a fair amount of drop out. I know people that were super enthusiastic at one point and now they don`t get out at all. I have fly fished since 1972 and every time I go out I learn something new. That is the true beauty of this wonderful pursuit.

[SilverDoctor]

Something to remember when sharing. Poachers read these posts also.

[billie]

On the river and/or in person, wide open in discussions.

 

On the internet, not so much , Lornce's comments notwithstanding.

 

When I first took to the web for information, I found quite quickly that the information I sought detracted from my pursuit. (This is a personal comment, not advice.) My enjoyment is derived by the journey, not the destination. I'm completely self taught and wouldn't have it any other way.

 

I understand why people want specifics. It takes a lot of time and energy to get to a fishing spot, let alone search for one. And when you find one, it is easy to feel protective of it. But many people do not have the time, and only get weekends where competition is higher. I guess "catching" is paramount to enjoyment for some. Not to be misunderstood, I love to "catch" fish, but if I don't, it is not a lost day for me.

 

Generic information about techniques have a place on the net, specifics, no.

 

JMHO.

[reset]

Something to remember when sharing. Poachers read these posts also.

This is so true. Ive seen on other forums where a place gets named too much and next thing you know theres the typical garbage dump left behind where it was once fairly clean. And in the case of ponds where its more noticeable perhaps,so ill use it as a example, they get fished out in no time. As time goes by or as i get older maybe, or as more population is fishing im not as willing to divulge as much as i used too.

[SilverDoctor]

Years ago I named a specific stream location where a very big Brown resided. She was a big breeder and topped the 32" mark. Looked for her again and found bait containers and the leftover skeletal remains of that filleted fish. It bothered me, some of the small stream fish especially I end up with an intimate relationship with. These smaller waters deserve protection, not mobs. I would rather they be my own experience or that of trusted old friends.

 

Pictures are great reports are good along with bug reports, flies and water conditions. Many of the spots I fish are a bit secluded, others fish there but others respect it also. Not everyone does. Streams especially will get fished out by unthinking people. Bigger water and lakes are a different story. I like to act as not only Fly fisherman but a steward and be a bit thoughtful in these years.

 

I love seeing reports but ones that are more general about the location.

[bigalcal]

I'm pretty non-specific/vague when it comes to reporting the "cutty" waters I fish. There are so many spots to fish in the area that I'd rather readers come and discover on their own.

[scel]

Nice post Scel.

 

Of course, this is an age old question; who polices it then? Who decides what is appropriate or not when it comes to the issue "hotspotting" when it really is subjective. Stauffer is small water...but famous? Is that allowed? Who decides? We live in an information age, and information is readily accessible. Pretty tough to restrict it nowadays. It really is up to the individual ethos of every angler. I generally don't post many reports anymore. And if I do, I, like you, don't mention spots unless they are famous, but that judgement is as arbitrary and subjective as the next guy.

 

As for the issue of the learning curve and "earning" it, well I have a slightly different take, perhaps. I'm all for beginners asking for or seeking help and getting it. I am not referring to merely holding the newbies hand and coddling them forever and not making them "earn" it, but pointing them in the right direction in terms of casting, flies, and yes, some more well known spots to go is not over the line. And the info is already there anyways. But yes, I do resent sometimes, the first question out of someone's mouth (before they congratulate you or thank you or show any modicum of appreciation) is " Where didja catch it?" . Yeesh.

 

However, let me put it a different way; all of us of the older generation like or cling to the rosy picture of "having to earn it" the old fashioned way and put our time on the water before the dawn of the internet and the information age. Kinda like the "I walked uphill both ways in 4 foot snowdrifts just to get to school" type attitude. Well...oh really? Devil's advocate here; the fly-fishing community likes to brag about having authored more books for our hobby than every other sport; or the common quote goes. So...don't think Lee Wulff or Roderick Haig Brown learned from others, or read some books? They were newbies once. What about Brooks, Whitlock, Kauffman, Kreh, and others? Of course, lots of them broke new ground and were innovators, but my point is that information sharing has been going on a long, long time. Well before the internet turned into jet speed instant gratification. Everyone was a newbie once.

 

Your point about policing is the most important, but simultaneously the most irrelevant. We have to both rely on ourselves and allow ourselves to be influenced about by the opinions of the community. There is a fly fishing community. There are groups and messageboards. It is through discussion that we begin to understand.

 

From my professional life, in community health education, there is a tipping point. Once a certain percentage of people know and understand the consequences of their actions, opinions begin to change. This an extreme comparison, but one that is personally sensitive. My mother died of smoking related lung cancer. Do you notice how quickly the movement to non-smoking public spaces happened? This movement was not on a national or even provincial level. This movement was far more grassroots, initiated by towns and cities. Many people took it as an affront to their personal freedoms. But now, only 10 years later, people accept and understand this policy.

 

I know that I am affected by the community. I just debarbed my size 16 and smaller flies. Everyone knows that I do not have to, but after (literally) years of discussion, I decided it was the right thing to do.

 

Pictures are great reports are good along with bug reports, flies and water conditions. Many of the spots I fish are a bit secluded, others fish there but others respect it also. Not everyone does. Streams especially will get fished out by unthinking people. Bigger water and lakes are a different story. I like to act as not only Fly fisherman but a steward and be a bit thoughtful in these years.

 

I love seeing reports but ones that are more general about the location.

 

I think fishing reports and good picture posts generate excitement and passion for the sport. I think that tipping point might exist for the angling community where people are not only excited about the fly fishing, but also excited and passionate about the conservation and stewardship.

 

Thanks for the discussion. It has helped me sort my opinions.

[northfork]

On the river and/or in person, wide open in discussions.

 

On the internet, not so much , Lornce's comments notwithstanding.

 

When I first took to the web for information, I found quite quickly that the information I sought detracted from my pursuit. (This is a personal comment, not advice.) My enjoyment is derived by the journey, not the destination. I'm completely self taught and wouldn't have it any other way.

 

I understand why people want specifics. It takes a lot of time and energy to get to a fishing spot, let alone search for one. And when you find one, it is easy to feel protective of it. But many people do not have the time, and only get weekends where competition is higher. I guess "catching" is paramount to enjoyment for some. Not to be misunderstood, I love to "catch" fish, but if I don't, it is not a lost day for me.

 

Generic information about techniques have a place on the net, specifics, no.

 

JMHO.

 

I agree 100% with this. It is the new era of a lot of fisherman they just expect people to tell them where when and how. Half the fun for me was and still is figuring it out. I for one am just getting sick of 4x4ing down goat trails for 30 km thinking nobody will be at the end only to find two camps and 4-5 vehicles. I don't know if that's due to the recession and more people have more time to fish, or if Alberta really is getting that populated.

[SilverDoctor]

When I was a youngun I had to earn my right to fish. Gramps, Dad, and Mom all tied flies and fished. I could not go on a trout fishing trip with Dad till I could tie a perfect Classic Royal Coachman... and cast it into a coffee cup. It was a rite of passage that I was proud of. So different of today's demands of instant satisfaction.

[lad]

I have never posted a hot spot and never will. It does nothing for the fish either.

[LastBoyScout]

Hate em.

[Swede]

I could really careless myself. I do what I want when I want how I want. Seriously though am a lot like most of the posters I like to figure out things on my own. There's people every where I've ever fished I still catch fish so I don't really care one way or another about peoples reports.

[UrbanRedneck]

I feel fIshIng reports are a good thIng. I joIned thIs forum to meet some folks, make some new frIends and maybe learn a few thIngs doIng It. I have fIshed the bow sInce I was a young chIld. I grew up just a couple blocks from the rIver and was lucky enough to spend countless hours walkIng shorelInes wIth my old man. We met numerous men and women who also had a love for fly fIshIng and wouldn't hesItate to let you know what was workIng at the tIme. We were all novIces at one poInt In our lIves and many of us dId learn to love/hate the Bow rIver the hard way. How many tImes have you ran Into fellow anglers and stopped to have a chat? Asked what they are bItIng on? I agree that puttIng In your tIme Is necessIty on thIs fIshery as It can be extremely hot or very cold fIshIng. And many of us have put In a LOT of mIles on It. We all have our secret spots and for all I know someone else may consIder those spots theIr secret spots as well. I am proud to catch fIsh out of the rIver but just gettIng out to do It Is the bIggest reward to me. CatchIng healthy fIsh Is a defInIte bonus. Now a days, my bIg reward Is teachIng my 2 boys to fly fIsh In the Bow rIver. I am even prouder when they use what I have told/showed them to do so. I wIll not tell them everythIng I know, because some of the best memorIes I have are of learnIng thIngs on my own. ExperIence Is our greatest teacher as far as I am concerned and many of us have put In a great deal of tIme to gather thIs knowledge and experIence. I read the rIver reports, I talk to other fIsherman, I apprecIate people's knowledge and experIence. I won't gIve up my secret spots but I'll defInitely help out fellow fIsherman and fIsher women any way I can.

 

Jay

[Ricinus]

I post phony ones just to throw people off the track..

 

Mike

[bowbonehead]

as the song goes..... you call some place Paradise.... Kiss it Goodbye

[Smitty]

as the song goes..... you call some place Paradise.... Kiss it Goodbye

 

Great song, underrated one from that album.

[flyfishy]

Happy Canada Day pals, Well I know forsure I'm going to be on my better behavior !

Not sure how lol , But I get it .

Still saying hook size restrains help...

Love your Land do something good for CanadaDay! I'm BBQ

U?

[jpinkster]

I fished Crawling Valley Reservoir a couple of nights ago. It was on the water for about 6 hours. It took me 3 hours to find my first fish. There are times when the bite is off, but this did not ‘feel’ like one of those times. It was sunny with blustery conditions. I was on the windswept side of the lake. These are usually good pike conditions. I found a cell signal and found a depth map for the Crawling Valley. I heard had great structure, but I had no idea how varied and diverse the lake structure is. It is much more like a Canadian Shield lake than your typical Albertan pothole. I put on a heavier sink tip and retargeted my approach. I caught my first pike, cross referenced depth and weed growth with overall visible structure. And then I started catching many pike. And when the sun started going down, I started catching walleye (a couple over 20”) and bigger pike (this is a good sign, because the biggest pike will follow walleye feeding patterns). Overall, my success took a culmination of all my experience. I had earn my learning. I never encountered anyone else all day. It was almost a perfect day fly fishing. I couldn’t wait to write a report.

 

 

But then I stopped to think about it. CVR is potentially one of those reasonable areas where the structure and lake size make it just difficult enough to fish, but also gives lots of opportunities. With the regulations being catch and release for all pike and walleye, it will potentiate the good breeders (and good food sources to make big fish) will stay alive to build a healthy fishery. With increased pressure and environmental sensitivity on the east-slope streams, pike and walleye fishing are slightly more insulated.

CVR makes me really sad. We used to go there and catch them by the dozens regardless of the conditions. Over-pressure has done a number on that lake, and I'm really pleased that pike are also catch and release only.

 

When it comes to reports...I'm happy to share conditions and what's working...but I won't share specific locations. There's plenty of good water out there, a little exploring can go a very long way.

[jgib01]

I thought the golden rule was that you could show someone a spot, but never tell them. Pretty subjective in terms of what one person might find "general" information versus what others would consider hotspotting. It certainly seems to me that fly fishers in general tend to lean more easily to the latter. I know I've taken some heat for even mentioning the name of a river on here, which I think is a little overzealous, but in some ways understandable. I still consider myself a newcomer to this game, and have greatly appreciated the times when I have been given some general information to get me going in the right direction these past couple of years.

[adams]

I have never posted a report and don't see the point in it. I don't think you are helping any newbies by posting reports or photos and you sure aren't helping the fish or the environment. Each year pressure increases and they aren't making any new rivers. I fear that fly fishing is becoming the new "cool" thing to do and the true meaning is lost. I just spent the afternoon cleaning up my "secret" camp site which was full of bottles,cans, ping pong balls? and burnt camping chairs. I always carry garbage bags with me and ran out. I find this form useful for sharing info on technique and gear. If the reports and grip and grin sections were deleted I wouldn't miss them.

[kstick]

Great topic, lot's of good points.

 

I occasionally post reports, but I read them more frequently. I don't read looking for specifics other than water level, clarity, and maybe some general insight about current insect hatches. The Bow is a big stream, and when I have time to fish it I have to plan for a 2 hour drive and like to have a little "local knowledge" to go on. Last week I read through reports for a few days, then walked and waded on Friday. It was generally a slow day, but it was worth it for the one feisty, large Rainbow I caught after switching to a streamer - something I probably wouldn't have done without having read the reports.

 

Our smaller Brown Trout streams and Cutty streams are more vulnerable. I worry when I see streams named in reports. But, for the most part those reports are few and far between on this forum. Unfortunately, there are some FB groups where streams are named and photos are posted of fish held high and dry or laying on sand etc.

 

This brings me to my final points. As a middle-aged, long time fly fisher I feel a responsibility for protecting the resource AND for educating newbies. I've been in AB for 18 years and still feel like a newbie on many streams. I have taken newbies to some of my favorite places, and I've asked them not to tell anyone else. Show but not tell if they also appreciate the concept of resource conservation. I also like the idea of photos showing fish, flies, and streams in the background, as long as the fish are properly cared for. Newbies or anyone else can learn fly selection and fishy water from a picture without having a stream named. And some of us will occasionally recognize our favorite spot, or even a fish.