Fish Stocking

[DonAndersen]

Guys,

 

Here is a fisheries survey. Although it concerns lakes there are two areas that bear attention.,

 

1] Pine Coulee may go to trout. Sterile trout. Unless some intelligent management creeps into ESRD, I suspect 5 a day + ice fishing.

 

2] Struble Lake + other lakes in the province illegally stocked with perch. The Govt asks if the public would support retention.

Ya' all gotta be kidding - why in the hell would anyone support an illegal activity. That is the best way to support further perch infestations. Idiotic.

By the way - Struble Lake raised fish over 10 lbs. I used to catch them over 6 lbs [ not inches] regularly.

 

https://talkaep.alberta.ca/fisheries-engagement?utm_medium=email&utm_source=eloqua&utm_campaign=OUTDOORS_20170222_ABFisheriesSurvey&cvosrc=email.eloqua.OUTDOORS_20170222_ABFisheriesSurvey&elqTrackId=4e949663189f4e78a844d7b65672aa67&elq=f3a3748b67f24ab69f1ee79564fd62c6&elqaid=7926&elqat=1&elqCampaignId=13534

 

And with that I'm off tying again.

 

Don

 

[jpinkster]

Pine Coulee has failed as a walleye fishery for whatever reason. While I'm supportive of the move to a trout lake, I can't help but think of the size of this lake. In order to have any kind of fishery they would have to put tens of thousands of fish into this lake every year. I did read somewhere the PCR has fairly high mercury content, that may impact whether it is a C&R or a catch and keep lake.

Having a trout lake in this area would be a positive thing. With Chain and PCR hopefully a lot of the yahoos would stay off the native trout streams and pummel a bunch of farm fish instead.

[Sparkplug]

Guys,

 

Here is a fisheries survey. Although it concerns lakes there are two areas that bear attention.,

 

1] Pine Coulee may go to trout. Sterile trout. Unless some intelligent management creeps into ESRD, I suspect 5 a day + ice fishing.

 

2] Struble Lake + other lakes in the province illegally stocked with perch. The Govt asks if the public would support retention.

Ya' all gotta be kidding - why in the hell would anyone support an illegal activity. That is the best way to support further perch infestations. Idiotic.

By the way - Struble Lake raised fish over 10 lbs. I used to catch them over 6 lbs [ not inches] regularly.

 

https://talkaep.alberta.ca/fisheries-engagement?utm_medium=email&utm_source=eloqua&utm_campaign=OUTDOORS_20170222_ABFisheriesSurvey&cvosrc=email.eloqua.OUTDOORS_20170222_ABFisheriesSurvey&elqTrackId=4e949663189f4e78a844d7b65672aa67&elq=f3a3748b67f24ab69f1ee79564fd62c6&elqaid=7926&elqat=1&elqCampaignId=13534

 

And with that I'm off tying again.

 

Don

 

 

Thanks Don. To my mind, the perch question is a tough call - I appreciate your point about retention amounting to condoning an illegal act. But what is the alternative? Do we just write off Struble as having been permanently lost to the perch, or are there other alternatives that could eliminate the perch population and at least create a chance of this lake being restored to its previous trout glory?

 

If Struble were to somehow be rid of perch, I wonder what the risk is of repeat illegal stocking. I don't know the history here, but I would imagine that the lakes were stocked with perch some time ago, i.e., pre-internet times...maybe today, things might be different, in terms of the risk of illegal perch stocking? Maybe that's just naive, and it's almost a given that if one or more of these lakes were to be rid of perch, they'd just get illegally stocked again anyways.

 

But maybe...one or two high-awareness "rehab" initiatives might have a chance of success (vs. 0, in their current state). It's the old Wayne Gretzky quote - "you miss 100% of the shots you don't take".

[Smitty]

The "incentive / dis-incentive theory" is a failure in my opinion. Do you really think the incentive theory has saved Beaver from being infected? If so, can I see some evidence / proof? Trouble is, its exceeding difficult to prove a negative, right?

 

They should at least try a pilot program - somewhere - let the lake have a no limit on perch.

 

Stock perch lakes with Tigers and Splake; don't they eat the perch too? Why do 90+% of our lakes only have one species of trout? Many successful lakes elsewhere support multiple species.

 

Just an alternative viewpoint. Maybe the best and cheapest alternative is to learn to live with the perch and decimate them as best we can. Government seems terribly reluctant to do rotenone, plus, it has limited use. Can we get some sterile pike? I jest.

[monger]

Having used nets to remove 100,000+ perch out of Sundance lake with no effect, I would suggest that angling pressure would have little to no effect on the perch population. The answer is Rotenone !

[Swede]

I don't get why they have to always have these surveys. Just do your %@$$#% job you brain dead bunch of twits.

 

Pretty sure the cost of the failed aerating equipping they bought last year would have turned some of these perched lakes back into trout lakes.

[jpinkster]

I don't get why they have to always have these surveys. Just do your %@$$#% job you brain dead bunch of twits.

 

Pretty sure the cost of the failed aerating equipping they bought last year would have turned some of these perched lakes back into trout lakes.

Clearly you aren't paying attention. Stakeholder input is important with these decisions. "Doing your job" could be in direct conflict with what the public wants. Last I checked this is still democracy.

[DonAndersen]

Jordan,

That is exactly why Govt does sweet f... Nothing.

I gave listened to the locals talk about perch removal. Nope - not interested. Gotta have some place for the kids. Trouble is I have yet to see one of those kids.

What people say and do are a world apart.

 

Don

[DonAndersen]

As far as that age old story - remove perch and the assholes will just do it again.

That is the reason we don't lock up people after they rob banks. They will just do it again.

Till this govt had the balls to do something about perch, we will continue to lose more lakes.

At this point, we have lost Phyllis, Tay, Twin, Crimson, Cow and Struble. That makes about 1/2 of them screwed.

The Govts action to this point is not apparent other than rewarding the perch stocking Angler's by having a limit on vermin.

Fished once at Crimson and got checked at the dock by the Officers. He counted the perch twice to make sure I wasn't over my limit.

He had no answer to the question "why am I allowed to benefit from an illegal act"?

 

Don

[jpinkster]

I was referencing the decision to made on PCR not Struble, should have been more clear. Transitioning a lake from a pike/walleye fishery to a trout fishery is the type of thing AEP should be gathering stakeholder input on.

[BrianR]

I doubt that they asked us stakeholders ,if we wanted Walleye.

[Swede]

Clearly you aren't paying attention. Stakeholder input is important with these decisions. "Doing your job" could be in direct conflict with what the public wants. Last I checked this is still democracy.

Oh is that why i had so many choices in their Survey, Bloody ^%%$## stupid dropping a mid level predator into most Alberta lakes.to the point that there stunted. And still not letting people harvest any. Than asking me if i want to allow people to harvest the best biggest breeders in said lake

 

That's quite the management plan lol.

 

Ya i didn't mean to like your post that was an accident.

[BrianR]

Here is a thought.Just before the Gov.,shut down commercial fishing.They virtually forced these guys to come up with live capture traps.How about doing that,take the fish over the highway to Travers,Mcgregor.It imo would appease the walleye guys.Then it could be said they are stocking catchable Walleye in AB.Manitoba has been doing this with great success.They identify a lake.To be converted to a trout lake.Live capture pike,perch,walleye.Transport to nearest accessible warm water species lake.I used to do the fish rescue in the irriagation canal..Why not do this... Maybe after the orginal slaugther,place the nets.Saves using ROETONE

[Smitty]

Isn't the problem with Rotenone is that it pretty much obliterates other gilled organisms, including aquatic invertebrates?

 

As an aside, and I'm not excusing the gov't by any means, but fisheries management in this province is incredibly challenging. You got the put and take guys to appease, the fanatical fly fishing QSF catch and releasers, the Lac la Biche and S. AB crowd that want to eat their walleye, the guys that specialize in hammering jumbo perch, the Lakers crowd fishing / loving Cold Lake to death, the let's make kid-friendly fisheries, gotta make the ice fishermen happy, first nations rights, etc...

 

Add to that an historic overall lack of water, a 400% increase in population translating into more users and stakeholders, gov't mismanagement, lack of gov't foresight, lack of gov't pro-activeness, combating decades of way to liberal keep and possession limits, sure as hell ain't easy managing fisheries these days, especially when you're part of the problem.

[Dangus]

http://www.webcitation.org/6DG6HWJJV

[monger]

Invertebrates will quickly recolonize. A year of rest or very low fish stocking would let the bugs rebound even better

[angler]

Monger: I wonder????

The upper Bow has NOT seen a real recovery of the stonefly population post the flooding and silting events that decimated it in the years prior to 'the flood'. In this case the recovery has been slow at best.

[ÜberFly]

And TransAlta has yet to pay any fines (in fact, have they actually been fined?)?!

 

and silting events that decimated it in the years prior to 'the flood'. .

[SilverDoctor]

Monger: I wonder????

The upper Bow has NOT seen a real recovery of the stonefly population post the flooding and silting events that decimated it in the years prior to 'the flood'. In this case the recovery has been slow at best.

Not to mention a number of mayfly and Caddis.

[Swede]

Funny just about everywhere else uses rotenone as a fish management tool.

 

Here's a lake In BC that was rotenoned in 2011 i believe. I realize Alberta is different and management is a lot harder for sure but its almost like they don't even try.

Not another angler on the lake that i can see. Wow must be nice.

 

 

[DonAndersen]

But is the reduction in bug life a direct result of sewage being removed from the river. The Crow really changed from a bug factory after the sewage was all pumped to Frank.

 

Don

[monger]

I think it is difficult to compare a rather sterile river like the upper Bow and a lake

[danhunt]

Rotenone is toxic to aquatic invertebrates as well as fish, but it doesn't affect all fish or insects equally. In broad strokes, trout and perch are susceptible to a lower concentration than say catfish or carp, so the over-all effect on the ecosystem as a whole is going vary depending on the type of fish being managed. Mayflies are more sensitive than caddis, which are more sensitive than shrimp and dragonflies etc. That said, the rule of thumb is that it takes a concentration two orders of magnitude greater to kill all of the insects than it does all of the fish. There was a discussion on the flybc board some years ago when there was talk of using Rotenone as a management tool, and there was a lot of irrational fear about how it "nukes" a lake but consider this - aboriginal peoples living a subsistence lifestyle in South America commonly use Rotenone as a fishing method. The fact that it doesn't harm them, and the fact that they can continue to catch fish from the same waters generation after generation should tell us something. I think the real reason its not used more is likely because of the monetary cost.

 

If the fisheries department decides a management plan isn't working and they want to stock different fish in a lake, as is being discussed with PCR, then I think that's fine. If a lake is illegally stocked I don't think the new fish should be included in the management plan from there on out. I think the lake should be closed to all fishing immediately until it can be killed off and restocked according to the original management plan.