Our Day In Court Approaches....

[jpinkster]

The Oldman River poaching court case is only a few days away. I had a chance to talk to a few folks that are familiar with these types of proceedings, and they wanted to pass along a few tips:

 

-absolutely no hats in the courtroom while it is is session; you will probably be approached by CAPS if you have a hat on and will be "asked" curtly to remove it
-if court is not yet in session when you enter the courtroom, respectfully rise when the judge enters and do not sit until (s)he does
-if you enter after court is already in session, a little bow toward the bench as you come in is not entirely out of line; most public don't do this, but you will see lawyers and social workers do this as they enter and leave (especially if going to the the bench area); it's a little ingratiating and old school, but some folks still do it
-if you are leaving the courtroom while court is in session, do so in as quiet a fashion as possible; again a little bow toward the bench as you leave doesn't hurt
-any talking during the session must be to an absolute minimum, and only in whispers
-no food or drink of any kind in the courtroom

For security:
-no knives, and would be a good idea to leave foreceps and nippers (pretty much any metal for that matter) behind in your vehicle as well; all of the larger courthouses have metal detectors now at the door... not sure about Pincher, but wouldn't be surprised if they have moved to this too
-not sure they would be all that keen on studded boots; CAPS may not let you in the building with them on as they may mark up and damage tiled floor

Other info for folks attending:
-it sounds like this is a first appearance, so the accused might not even all be there; charges will likely be read, or the accused may waive reading of the charges; not likely they will enter pleas
-typical first appearance usually ends in an adjournment for accused to get legal representation; if they already have counsel, a plea may be entered, but that would be the exception
-if these guys are from Lethbridge, and they have counsel, there may be a request made to move the next hearing to Lethbridge
-court docket is usually posted outside the courtroom somewhere, which will give you the proper spelling of the accused names, and charges that have been brought
-if you are in the courtroom before it begins, you may be sitting amongst the accused, and you will not know who's who until their matter is called; careful what you say to the guy sitting next to you

For those of you who would like to attend, or are looking for more details, please see my blog: http://www.pikepinksterab.blogspot.ca/2015/09/anglers-go-to-court.html

[jpinkster]

Folks,

 

I had a chance to speak with the Calgary Herald this afternoon, it sounds like they are going to carry a piece on this story. Looking forward to seeing a few of you in Pincher Creek tomorrow. I can be reached at 403-651-9126.

 

Thanks,

Jordan

[jpinkster]

Herald story here:

 

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-news/wild-things-anglers-rally-against-poaching-in-oldman-river

[Sage]

well done Jordan, appreciate you keeping this in the forefront.

[Spurly]

Nice job.

[brokentippet]

Wow....1000 dollar fines and a licence suspension...talk about a slap on the wrist

[WesG]

Wow....1000 dollar fines and a licence suspension...talk about a slap on the wrist

I hope you're joking....

 

What happened today to anyone that was there? $1000 per fish and a lifetime fishing ban?.... right?????

[brokentippet]

http://globalnews.ca/news/2248567/6-lethbridge-men-plead-guilty-to-charges-of-poaching-threatened-fish/

[ÜberFly]

Insulting!!

[Ricinus]

......

[Birddog]

Not enough for sure.

[MattyTaylor]

Thanks for organizing and representing Jordan. I was really hoping they'd use this as a cautionary example of what happens if you get caught poaching (and more specifically to this magnitude and disregard). What a toothless "punishment" for such an impactful crime. Let's all remain vigilant and protect our waters. It took a while but thanks to many of your suggestions, I now have report a poacher in my phone and have used it twice. Between education for an ignorant few not "knowingly" breaking the rules and hopefully a C.O. stick for all the rest, we can make an impact.

[Sage]

Judges ruling and amount of the fines needed to send a much stronger message...... add me to the list of the disappointed

[fishinglibin]

That is a complete joke. Our failed justice system shows its true feelings again. Almost a waste of time for the CO. Thanks JP for your efforts. Lets start a CO court and let them dish out the penalties while advised by a few FFC members.

[jpinkster]

Folks,

 

I think I have an obligation to tell as much of the story as I can since I was in attendance today:

 

The item was not addressed until near the end of the day. The group that showed up endured nearly 6 hours of cases, and I thank all of them for their patience. At once point the judge even mentioned that there were no more cases on the listing, but there were still so many people in attendance.

 

All 6 individuals entered a guilty plea on their charges. Initially the crown had asked for fines of $1,000 PER FISH (about $5K per person), the seizure of their fishing gear, the cancellation of their licences and prohibition of future licenses for 5 years.

 

These individuals were relatively new Canadians and had very low incomes. The defense suggested that they were fishing for sustenance, and that as first time offenders there should be some leeway. The judge ultimately agreed that while these charges were serious, the sentence needed to be proportional to the individuals in question. It was decided that they would each be fined $1,000, would receive their fishing gear back and would have their licences cancelled for the remainder of the year. It should also be pointed out that this was a first offense.

 

Am I satisfied with the sentencing? No I am not. Do I understand why it went the way that it did? Absolutely. I'm glad I was in attendance, it helped build a tremendous amount of perspective on this issue. I spoke with our F&W friends on the way out, and they greatly appreciated seeing us there to support this. Another great note is that 4 separate media outlets were in attendance, and I did interviews for 7 different outlets today. The coverage on this story will be very broad. Tomorrow morning I will be on CBC Radio for their EyeOpener program at 7:10 to discuss this issue.

 

For those of you that are not satisfied with the outcome (virtually all of us) I strongly urge you to write a letter to your MLA and to the Environment Minister.

[jpinkster]

You can see more on the story from the Pincher Creek Voice here:

http://www.pinchercreekvoice.com/2015/09/six-lethbridge-men-plead-guilty-to.html

 

The thing that saddens me most is that nearly all of these fish were of spawning age, and most were females.

[ÜberFly]

Thanks for your efforts Jordan and crew!

[jpinkster]

I'll on be on Calgary Eyeopener in 15 minutes on CBC Radio. I'll share a link once they have one up.

[bcubed]

$1000, give them their rods back and say no more fishing this year. What a joke. They'll just go places where it's harder to catch them. Shoulda kept their rods and given them a permanent ban, regardless of their background

[SilverDoctor]

Quote from the - Pincher Ceek Voice

http://www.pinchercreekvoice.com/search/label/News

----------------------------------------------------

"Six men from Lethbridge were at the Pincher Creek Provincial Court today, Tuesday September 29, to face charges related to poaching fish from the Oldman River. Kanchan Subba, Harka Gurung, Suk Bahadur Subba, Sunny Gurung, Sha Bahadur Subba, and Dhan Kumar Gurung were tried as a group, and pleaded guilty to a charge of Unlawfully Caught Fish."

------------------------------------------------

I did see you on the CBC, very well spoken, I also agree that the fines where way to lenient. Since when does "fishing for sustenance" come into play as a defense or that of "new Canadians"? In my opinion there should have been a five year license ban along with equipment seizure. And the cancellation of licenses for the remainder of a season that is almost over for that body of water is also a joke. I also notice that by the published names of the offenders they shared a last name. I wish thy had also shared a fishing regulation and the honesty to read and obey a sign.

[jpinkster]

I spoke with the F&W guys. They really appreciated us being in attendance, and were certainly gunning for something a bit more severe.

 

Despite everything, we should consider what has transpired over the last 24 hours a huge win. This story got WAY more media attention than it likely would have otherwise, so we certainly won the PR battle. If through this we can raise some awareness, send a clear message to poachers and have some ammunition to go back to the Enviro Minister with...that's a positive.

[TroutPanther]

Quote from the - Pincher Ceek Voice

http://www.pinchercreekvoice.com/search/label/News

----------------------------------------------------

"Six men from Lethbridge were at the Pincher Creek Provincial Court today, Tuesday September 29, to face charges related to poaching fish from the Oldman River. Kanchan Subba, Harka Gurung, Suk Bahadur Subba, Sunny Gurung, Sha Bahadur Subba, and Dhan Kumar Gurung were tried as a group, and pleaded guilty to a charge of Unlawfully Caught Fish."

------------------------------------------------

I did see you on the CBC, very well spoken, I also agree that the fines where way to lenient. Since when does "fishing for sustenance" come into play as a defense or that of "new Canadians"? In my opinion there should have been a five year license ban along with equipment seizure. And the cancellation of licenses for the remainder of a season that is almost over for that body of water is also a joke. I also notice that by the published names of the offenders they shared a last name. I wish thy had also shared a fishing regulation and the honesty to read and obey a sign.

X2

Great work Jordan for drumming up support and media around this issue. But it stings to hear these guys got their gear back, to poach another day. Sustenance is a poor excuse when we have put & take fisheries, some not far from Lethbridge, take your limit from them - I hope at least they were educated about these opportunities.

[jpinkster]

I wonder if we want to collectively put together a package for them that outlines the fisheries they can take from in the area?

[Lenny]

Being a new Canadian if in fact they are Canadian citizen's is no excuse for breaking the law if it was any of us as fisherman doing this the fines and consequences would have been more severe this is BS

[Jayhad]

what a joke, do we have the name of the judge? I'd like to send him some feedback