Discontinuation Of The Stewardship License Pilot Project

[Taco]

http://files.ctctcdn.com/c37eef03101/2246ac76-5bed-404c-9570-907ff8e36816.pdf

 

http://www.tucanada.org/index.asp?p=2055&vn=438

[Smitty]

Disappointed.

[Frenchie]

Fun while it lasted. The numbers dont show recovery in native species though, but maybe could have been extended a couple years more to see a longer term impact?

[SilverDoctor]

I think we can see it as an experiment that showed what removing Brookies by anglers would do. I was chatting with Lindley the Provincial Biologist involved and he said basically although the Brookies were reduced Cutties and Bulls didn't move back in in bigger numbers. Too many other factors in play. The biggest positive that came out of the program is public awareness and the angler involvement with proper fish ID. I enjoyed the program while it lasted and am grateful to have been a part of it. I have to say I have always loved Brook Trout because of their beauty. And the opportunity got me out to some streams I might have missed. Along with that met some great people Except for Taco, who topped my totals every year.

[bcubed]

Shame to lose it, as it was a great event to keep people engaged with the rivers they love.

Will be interesting to see where these rivers/creeks are in 10 years, like if Quark re-colonized with brookies

[Weedy1]

http://files.ctctcdn.com/c37eef03101/2246ac76-5bed-404c-9570-907ff8e36816.pdf

 

http://www.tucanada.org/index.asp?p=2055&vn=438

 

 

So where will you point to in order to ease your Brookie frustrations? Maybe you'll can rig yourself up a portable frying pan so you can eat them all along the way a still stay within your limit?

[McLeod]

"There is also concern that focussed angling efforts could have the unintended consequence of increased incidental hooking mortality of native species. "

 

I find this comment in the TU article very interesting.

[sldrose]

this may be a dumb question but, is there a reason that a stocking pilot isn't being considered to see if natives can reclaim a foothold now that the brookie numbers have been diminished?

[bcubed]

native and stocking aren't really a good combination..

[jpinkster]

I'm a little disappointed to see G of A walk away from this program. It was TU and smaller angler groups doing most of the work on this from my understanding, G of A just gave approvals to allow for harvesting.

[midgetwaiter]

I'm a little disappointed to see G of A walk away from this program. It was TU and smaller angler groups doing most of the work on this from my understanding, G of A just gave approvals to allow for harvesting.

 

Not really, it was a Government initiative started by the former area biologist, Jim Stelfox.

 

I went to the information session and what it comes down to is that if your goal is to recover native species removing brook trout doesn't matter. We did a great job on the brookies but the cuttie's population remained flat. It's just plain don't work.

 

There's a new hypothesis they're testing now, the idea is that the brook trout don't move in and displace the cutts and bulls. However if something should happen where the native trout population is suppressed then the brookies can move in and replace them where the original problem is something that has less impact on brook trout. They're guessing that it's silt doing the real damage. Much more impact on the redds of spring spawners than fall spawners.

[midgetwaiter]

this may be a dumb question but, is there a reason that a stocking pilot isn't being considered to see if natives can reclaim a foothold now that the brookie numbers have been diminished?

This question was asked at the information session too. Biggest thing holding that back is availability of stock and figuring out what is the "right" genetics.

[jpinkster]

The're guessing that it's silt doing the real damage. Much more impact on the redds of spring spawners than fall spawners.

Don't let the OHV guys hear you making that suggestion.

[BurningChrome]

Don't let the OHV guys hear you making that suggestion.

There are bridges over Quirk on all the designated trails so anyone with wheels in water out there deserves a hefty fine. There was one bridge over it that got wiped out in 2013, but hopefully it was replaced last year through BTFR. I couldn't say for sure though since I haven't been to McLean in a couple years now.

[jpinkster]

I'll ask a new question about this:

 

I know there is a lot of sensitivity about stocking native trout into fluvial habitat...but what about fish relocation? If native trout aren't naturally coming back to these areas vacated by brook trout, could they be transported from a connected fishery?

[albertatrout]

I'll ask a new question about this:

 

I know there is a lot of sensitivity about stocking native trout into fluvial habitat...but what about fish relocation? If native trout aren't naturally coming back to these areas vacated by brook trout, could they be transported from a connected fishery?

Yes, the problem is there is a lot of concern about genetic diversity between systems and even from creek to creek. A few relocations have been done and there has been some aftermath genetically. It makes the government very hesitant to do anything involving moving fish, often to point of complete stupidity. I think the cancellation of this program comes down to dollars and cents more than anything, they really did not have enough years of data to say much with any real certainty. You will generally be needing at least 15 to 20 years of info to say much as natural population fluctuations and cycles can mask any trends, there are just too many factors at play in aquatic systems. Fisheries has seen a lot of cuts over the past year, funding is being diverted more towards things like climate change. It's a shame, many hoped things would improve under the new "regime".

[trailhead]

I tend to agree with Altatrout, the study period had the 2013 flood in it and you have to think that the fish were effected by that, so a longer time period would have put a more definitive point to the results. Plus when Jim was involved in the program he told me that the average size of the cutthroat in Quirk had increased. Which from what I can tell wasn't even addressed.

[Conor]

I wonder what Jim feels about this move?

 

I'm sorry I skipped the meeting. Figured it was a review of numbers; I should have known better. Was there any talk in the meeting of the success of the two tiered licensing system, and how that may effect management in future years?

 

Sorry to see this go, for personal reasons, as well. I only motivated last year to sign up, and enjoyed it thoroughly.

[SilverDoctor]

Another thing I wonder is how the past 2 years of low water will effect our small stream fisheries. I know that Brookies can stand more fluctuations and warm water occurrences than Cutties. Our streams are again low the bit of rain has helped but they are far from average rates. I have to agree also with Jim. The size of Cuts have increased. Perhaps a factor with less competition of food sources. Size may equal more robusque spawners in the long run. It should be interesting to see what happens to the target streams over the next few years and how the balance will pan out.

[jpinkster]

Last I spoke to Jim he was really concerned the program would be canned and not replaced with anything. I'm sure he isn't very pleased.

[midgetwaiter]

I wonder what Jim feels about this move?

 

I'm sorry I skipped the meeting. Figured it was a review of numbers; I should have known better. Was there any talk in the meeting of the success of the two tiered licensing system, and how that may effect management in future years?

 

Sorry to see this go, for personal reasons, as well. I only motivated last year to sign up, and enjoyed it thoroughly.

 

 

Another attendee asked, "Has Jim seen this and what did he say"? It sounds like he challenged them on some things and they went back to investigate further but no specifics were offered.

 

I tend to agree with Altatrout, the study period had the 2013 flood in it and you have to think that the fish were effected by that, so a longer time period would have put a more definitive point to the results. Plus when Jim was involved in the program he told me that the average size of the cutthroat in Quirk had increased. Which from what I can tell wasn't even addressed.

 

It was to some degree. There was an hour's worth of slides with some detailed statistical analysis presented followed up by a couple hour's worth of discussion so it's difficult for me to recall all of it. I hope they made the slides available eventually.

[fishteck]

This program was questioned by many people. In theory the killing of Brook Trout should have benefited the "native trout population" but where does a program such as this stop? Was the next step to kill off the Rainbow and Brown Trout in the Bow and Oldman River Basin to protect the Whitefish population? I think not.

The protection of "Native Species" should have been done many years ago, Don't try and reverse history now. Accept that Brook Trout have established themselves in our west-slope watershed and enjoy the fishing

[albertatrout]

This program was questioned by many people. In theory the killing of Brook Trout should have benefited the "native trout population" but where does a program such as this stop? Was the next step to kill off the Rainbow and Brown Trout in the Bow and Oldman River Basin to protect the Whitefish population? I think not.

The protection of "Native Species" should have been done many years ago, Don't try and reverse history now. Accept that Brook Trout have established themselves in our west-slope watershed and enjoy the fishing

 

I would say we do not have to accept it in all systems. If there are waterfalls or barriers, efforts to remove non-native species can still be an option. It is being done successfully in small drainages, and there are other systems that may be targets in the future. For the most part I agree we need to accept it, but there are exceptions/ options that could turn the table against brookies in particular. Even if it means only a handful of additional native fish populations in headwaters creeks, it could help provide genetic refuges in the future. You won't win the battle without barriers/ intensive efforts so I don't expect much at current budget levels. Maybe in the future though.

[Smitty]

This program was questioned by many people. In theory the killing of Brook Trout should have benefited the "native trout population" but where does a program such as this stop? Was the next step to kill off the Rainbow and Brown Trout in the Bow and Oldman River Basin to protect the Whitefish population? I think not.

The protection of "Native Species" should have been done many years ago, Don't try and reverse history now. Accept that Brook Trout have established themselves in our west-slope watershed and enjoy the fishing

 

 

Yeah, I don't subscribe to this either. The way you get around the slippery slope fear mongering is to take each case on a case by case basis. Secondly, humans regularly try to correct past mistakes all the time. No point in going "oh well, we screwed it up, lets shrug our shoulders and carry on". A good example is that the bios and angling public have chosen not to adopt a resigned acceptance of lake trout in Yellowstone Lake. And good for them; they try to cull as many as possible. It's not about reversing time or history, its about humans managing their impact.

 

It was a good pilot program that had it's place targeting a few watersheds. With native, pure-strain cutthroat occupying less than 5% of their historical range, it was well worth the effort.

[Taco]

This program was questioned by many people. In theory the killing of Brook Trout should have benefited the "native trout population" but where does a program such as this stop? Was the next step to kill off the Rainbow and Brown Trout in the Bow and Oldman River Basin to protect the Whitefish population? I think not.

The protection of "Native Species" should have been done many years ago, Don't try and reverse history now. Accept that Brook Trout have established themselves in our west-slope watershed and enjoy the fishing

If some didn't like the culling program, wait until the stream poisonings start and it will. Yanks are only 20 yrs ahead of us with 15-20 fish daily limits, requirements to kill any angling caught invasive and stream poisoning in the name of native species restoration.