Tim Horton's Litter

[canadensis]

Blaming Tim Horton and his drive thru's for the litter in the ditches makes as much sense as blaming Opra's cuttlery drawer for her weight...

[jksnijders]

 

 

It would seem apparent that I blame the jerkoffs that can't help but throw *hit out the window.

[canadensis]

It would seem apparent that I blame the jerkoffs that can't help but throw *hit out the window.

 

Glad to hear it, where you lay blame has logic.

 

To others the solution appears to be ban drive thru's and paper cups.

[PeteZahut]

I am not sure what the problem with a reusable cup is?? I personally think using reusable cups is better than using paper cups. With the amount of coffee I drink it does make a difference in my eyes. One small effort by an individual is better than standing back and poking holes at every option. But I imagine that won't be good enough for Canadensis who seems to be jumping on everything. I don't drink Timmys but I do drink Starbucks. I also very rarely go through a drive-thru, it is usually quicker to go inside.

[duanec]

again oh the hypocracy.

 

Banff and Jasper allow no drive thru's for whatever reason yet hotels, restuarants, gift shops, roads, golf courses, tour busses, etc right in the prime wildlife corridor....

 

Easy to stomp out the small pointless things and turn a blind eye to the biggest culprits. Oh ya I forgot you cannot use a lead split shot in the Parks either...

i think the conversation was around does eliminating fastfood drive thru's help to control litter.

i had anectdotal evidence that yes in fact it had in jasper.

which is a park coincedentally, which yes is in a prime wildlife corridor.

huh, jeez if the park wasn't there, i wonder how o&g development, clearcut logging and surface mines would help protect the wildlife corridor.

probs better?

just wondering about that logic.

 

[canadensis]

I am not sure what the problem with a reusable cup is?? I personally think using reusable cups is better than using paper cups. With the amount of coffee I drink it does make a difference in my eyes. One small effort by an individual is better than standing back and poking holes at every option. But I imagine that won't be good enough for Canadensis who seems to be jumping on everything. I don't drink Timmys but I do drink Starbucks. I also very rarely go through a drive-thru, it is usually quicker to go inside.

 

Never did say there was a problem with a reusable cup. I am simply pointing out the folly in thinking that;

 

-This will reduce litter in the ditches. Lotsa other *hit in the ditches besides Tim cups. Paper cups are not toxic. There are way bigger causes to rally behind.

-So many people are willing to "sacrifice" and use a reusable cup and/or reusable shopping bags and think that this has some kind of impact. Same folly in thinking driving a hybrid is "helping" the environment??

 

The reality is the vast majority of people don't want to sacrifice things in their lives that will make a difference. So they pick a few small, irrelevant things, "green things" to do that are easy and add no inconvenience to their plush gluttenous lifestyle. It is mostly, if not all window dressing so people percieve you as being part of the whole solution BS.

 

Move to a smaller house walking/cycling distance to work, install a high effeceincy furnace, kill a moose for winter meat, plant a garden, don't live above your means, and try to be self sufficient with your BASIC needs. Bottom line is being a cheap old miser is very, if not the most "green" move you can make.

 

Not specific to this board, but most eco geeks are all about the perception but mostly clueless about reality. What is funny about it all is how many of'em in Cow Town work for big oil in one capacity or the other.

 

So you see Pete I am just (insert gay pokey guy here) trying to swim upstream here a bit as all the do gooders float by with rose colored glasses and their myopic attitudes of what makes a difference.

[canadensis]

huh, jeez if the park wasn't there, i wonder how o&g development, clearcut logging and surface mines would help protect the wildlife corridor.

probs better?

just wondering about that logic.

 

How bout neither hotels, logging, or O&G in some areas?

 

I can only think of one area in the Province like that. Luckily most don't know of it because there are no hotels, roads or restuarants.

 

Never have seen a Timmie cup in the area either.

 

 

 

[ÜberFly]

So what you are saying is we are all being sadly mislead to believe that "every little bit helps"?! I guess I'm throwing out my rose coloured lenses (and my travel mug)...

 

P

 

Never did say there was a problem with a reusable cup. I am simply pointing out the folly in thinking that;

 

-This will reduce litter in the ditches. Lotsa other *hit in the ditches besides Tim cups. Paper cups are not toxic. There are way bigger causes to rally behind.

-So many people are willing to "sacrifice" and use a reusable cup and/or reusable shopping bags and think that this has some kind of impact. Same folly in thinking driving a hybrid is "helping" the environment??

 

The reality is the vast majority of people don't want to sacrifice things in their lives that will make a difference. So they pick a few small, irrelevant things, "green things" to do that are easy and add no inconvenience to their plush gluttenous lifestyle. It is mostly, if not all window dressing so people percieve you as being part of the whole solution BS.

 

Move to a smaller house walking/cycling distance to work, install a high effeceincy furnace, kill a moose for winter meat, plant a garden, don't live above your means, and try to be self sufficient with your BASIC needs. Bottom line is being a cheap miser is very, if not the most "green" move you can make.

 

Not specific to this board, but most eco geeks are all about the perception but mostly clueless about reality. What is funny about it all is how many of'em in Cow Town work for big oil in one capacity or the other.

 

So you see Pete I am just (insert gay pokey guy here) trying to swim upstream here a bit as all the do gooders float by with rose colored glasses and their myopic attitudes of what makes a difference.

 

[ÜberFly]

But a ton of quads, rv's and red necks! LoL

 

P

 

 

 

How bout neither hotels, logging, or O&G in some areas?

 

I can only think of one area in the Province like that. Luckily most don't know of it because there are no hotels, roads or restuarants.

 

Never have seen a Timmie cup in the area either.

 

[duanec]

[canadensis]

But a ton of quads, rv's and red necks! LoL

 

P

 

Thank god none of that either, well for sure a few old red necks.

 

Never have seen dredlocks or spandex-metro hiking pants there either.

[PeteZahut]

You certainly have the right to your own opinion. The only issue I have with it is that you come across with the attitude that people making small changes has no impact and that only the big gestures mean anything. I also don't agree with your statement (or what seems to be your opinion) that the only gestures worth anything or those that must inconvenience you. Sorry, that doesn't align with my thinking which is fine. At the end of the day, we as a family unit do make small changes that make a difference to us. No one will notice and I don't care. We live in a big house in the burbs and drive to work and I am fine with it because that is our choice. We do things that we believe when added to what others do will make a difference in the long run. Anyways, we do what we do, you do what you do while others do what they can and at then end of the day it does make a difference. Small or large it is a difference and it is better than nothing at all. Just my two cents.

[duanec]

Never have seen dredlocks or spandex-metro hiking pants there either.

well played

 

[canadensis]

well played

 

It was a fact based statement.

 

[Tungsten]

OK if theres no drive thru then i go inside get my stuff to go and I'm on my way.Same cup same bag.

 

I live by two Timmie's and theres a high school and a Jr high right in the middle.Theres cups all over the community.I don't think i would be to far off if i said 98% of those cups are from students.Theres also a 7-eleven by the schools and guess what theres slurppie cups all over too.

 

Can't blame the stores,blame the parents for not teaching there kids what is right .

[Heimdallr]

Ultimately, the careless individual is to blame for their actions, but until we enact my dream law and start killing stupid people the easiest thing to do is prevent them from doing something stupid rather than allow them to do so.

[Tungsten]

It would be interesting to see what happened if they put a .50$ deposit on cups.My guess is kids would still throw them away.

[SupremeLeader]

People,

 

You're debating (with one individual) about whether or not littering is good or bad?

 

It just goes to show that anyone can twist things to suit their opinion/agenda even if it lacks any real logic.

 

Canadensis....what's next, telling all us to light up because smoking cures cancer?

 

Please.

[ÜberFly]

After seeing an American television commercial last night (facts included in the commercial, not reseached on my own)... I guess even if they use "recycled" paper to produce the cups, the cups themselves are not "recyclable" b/c they use some type of a waterproof (wax?) coating... Therefore, even if there was a deposit charged, they would just go into a landfill (or ditch, school yard, etc.)...

 

P

 

 

 

 

[canadensis]

Ultimately, the careless individual is to blame for their actions, but until we enact my dream law and start killing stupid people the easiest thing to do is prevent them from doing something stupid rather than allow them to do so.

 

Heh.. So you think more rules and eliminating drive thru's will stop this? Last I checked there are laws against littering and all kinds of roadside turn-outs with trash receptacals as well as signage along the roads that post the fine.

 

Some people poach while they are fishing, laws address that too. With the flawed logic some have I guess it would be an easier move to just ban fishing where poaching is a problem.

 

Please tell me how you or anyone would prevent someone else from doing something stupid? Remember, littering is against the law, there are Provincial laws, and local bylaws in every city, town, and municipality to curb it. I am sure everyone that litters knows it is illegal and wrong, just like all other laws that fools break.

[canadensis]

People,

 

You're debating (with one individual) about whether or not littering is good or bad?

 

Please.

 

My first post on littering was tonge in cheek, not too obvious, eh?

 

The garbage gives the inmate work programs and the 4H something to pick up in the spring. This is a self esteem builder for both groups.

 

Cups in the ditch are a win win the way I see it.

[Heimdallr]

My thoughts were not banning drive thru's or adding deposits. My thoughts were that better packaging and materials are necessary. You're not going to stop people from littering, but you could at least make what they might litter out of recyclable materials and make it in a way that is wholly biodegradable. Small change is better than no change. Your opinion seems to be that if you aren't going to win the world series you shouldn't play ball and that type of outlook is absolutely useless and unproductive on any level.

[wtforward]

Canadensis....On a more serious note and not to beat up on Timmies

but check out the paper filter they use to make the coffee...bleached

white as opposed the unbleached brown option. Health issue don't know

but I do know they are way behind Starbucks in recycling their coffee grounds.

It would be interesting to know the tons of good compostable coffee grounds

from Timmies that end up in the dump in Canada complete with the bleached

white filters intact. I regularly pick up coffee grounds for free from Strabucks

(their program and fair trade), nicely packaged, for the garden,

plants etc. The stuff is great and it works. I phoned Timmies down east about them getting

with the program. Their working on it; that was 8 months ago.

I suspect it's a hassle for them and the line ups aren't getting any shorter anyway.

 

[canadensis]

Canadensis....On a more serious note and not to beat up on Timmies

but check out the paper filter they use to make the coffee...bleached

white as opposed the unbleached brown option. Health issue don't know

but I do know they are way behind Starbucks in recycling their coffee grounds.

It would be interesting to know the tons of good compostable coffee grounds

from Timmies that end up in the dump in Canada complete with the bleached

white filters intact. I regularly pick up coffee grounds for free from Strabucks

(their program and fair trade), nicely packaged, for the garden,

plants etc. The stuff is great and it works. I phoned Timmies down east about them getting

with the program. Their working on it; that was 8 months ago.

I suspect it's a hassle for them and the line ups aren't getting any shorter anyway.

 

It boils down to two completely different customer bases, and what their expectations are of each said company. How Starbucks is marketed, programs as you mention are expected.

 

I would betcha that if Tim Horton made his cups out of a material that never degraded and was open strip mined in the whale back his customers would be happy if it saved them 2 bits on a cup of joe. That is just my hunch though.

[ÜberFly]

In this day and age, I think "programs like this" are compulsory!! Add to the fact that they shouldn't even hesitate to be industry leaders and be the 1st to offer biodegradable cups/utensils/plates/bags, etc. and if that technology isn't available spear head the development of that technology (much like Patagonia/Madden Mills did with recycled fleece - not a direct plug for Patagonia, but nonetheless). If there is not a market, create a market!!

 

P

 

It boils down to two completely different customer bases, and what their expectations are of each said company. How Starbucks is marketed, programs like this are expected.