Coming Across Mr. Bear

[cgyguy]

Just read and previewed the post regarding the bear sighting and I am interested in seeing what reactions people who HAVE run into a bear have been. You hear many stories, some good, some bad. I am intersted to know what people carry for bear deterent, or bells, or bangers or whatever. What makes you feel the safest around bears when fishing in areas where bears are present? What about cougars, or other animals? Just interested in everyones experience and opinions surrounding safety around animals?

 

Cheers

Cgyguy

[Jayhad]

I've never had an issue with a bear they've always given me and I them a wide berth. I carry either bear spray or in real tight bear areas a small 12gauge. (haven't had to carry since fishing coastal streams during salmon spawning).

 

Cougars scare me, my dad and a hunting partner had a close call with one last year. My dad's hunting buddy spun and shot a cougar as it was jumoing at them from the bush. I think for cougars the best bet is a dog. I'm not a dog guy, I actually dislike dogs, but I fish with the Humblefisherman a lot and having Maple Turdlington watching your back is very comforting.

 

I personally believe bears key into to bear bells just as they do a gun shot, so i never wear one.

[ÜberFly]

Jay, of course you mean "dinner bells"!! LoL

 

What a brilliant idea, let's sell something that doesn't work to tourists and make billions of $!!

 

P

I personally believe bears key into to bear bells just as they do a gun shot, so i never wear one.

 

[Hawgstoppah]

Bear spray is the best detterent. Other than that.... if one's sniffing you, just pee your pants and that makes them go away

 

(don't ask, use the search function and ye shall find)

[Guest frypan]

The whole worry about wild animal attack is way over done.

 

99.99 % of bear and cougar will run away and you never know they were there

 

100x more chance of dyeing in the car on the way fishing that becoming a meal for bear or cougar

 

ps if a bear was going to eat you a gun will most likely do no good it would happen before you get chance to get gun ready, unless you walk around 100% of time with one in the tube holding gun like you are ready to shoot, which I doubt guys do. if you carry a gun you do it for same reason a little kid likes a blanky or soother, it is a security thing only, makes you feel safe but really useless for most part

 

if guy s tote around gun then to many bear and cougar would get shot for no reason just because they think ' it was ready to attack ‘!

 

There are a few good video on you tubes that show bear charge, it happen fast!

 

I agree that pepper spray is the best, much better than toting around a gun! , oh and you can’t carry gun in the park.

 

[Pipestoneflyguy]

Lengthy discussion on the topic : Click here

 

Frypan - Your spelling is just getting ridiculous, since you chose to "rub it in" to the rest of us working taxpayers that you love being on EI so much, how about taking 10 seconds out of your busy day and using the spell check option. I figure since the rest of us are paying you to sit at home, that can be your new job ! - Performance appraisal will be forthcoming upon your next post

[Guest frypan]

Lengthy discussion on the topic : Click here

 

Frypan - Your spelling is just getting ridiculous, since you chose to "rub it in" to the rest of us working taxpayers that you love being on EI so much, how about taking 10 seconds out of your busy day and using the spell check option. I figure since the rest of us are paying you to sit at home, that can be your new job ! - Performance appraisal will be forthcoming upon your next post

 

Thanks for the pointer Darren!

 

 

Back to the original poster - pipe do you agree with my assessment of what I say about bear? Look like you live in park from what I read of you?

[Smitty]

...Post self-edited about spellchecking. I made my point, and it was perhaps a little over the top, and have noted so in a pm to Frypan...

[proflytyer]

I have encountered few bears,I do carry bear spray, but i totally agree that i am much more afraid of cougars. Bears you can try to avoid, mountain lions, not so much.

 

Kyle Snarr

[Smitty]

Back to topic:

 

1) I have seen training videos where spray is used effectively.

2) Was told by my wilderness survival instructor that bells are next to useless, annoy other people, and may mimic the sounds of a marmot or other prey. Alternatively, try singing or talking in loud voices.

3) Only very experienced people who handle guns on a regular basis, i.e. you actually hunt nearly every season, will have the know how to use a gun effectively. Not to mention the question could they use it in a defensive situation and keep their nerve and a steady hand.

 

Hence, I carry spray, an emergency whistle, and a knife (the latter 2 being essential components of a survival kit anyways).

 

Best thing to do is to minimize the times you are in bear dense country and fishing alone. Always best to take a buddy, preferably groups of 3 or 4. Though, admittedly, I have violated that rule numerous times, liking the solitude, and/or not being able to find someone to fish with.

 

Smitty

 

P.S. Kyle; complete agreement about cougars. More afraid of them. They tend to be quieter animals too. At least the defence strategy against cougars is straightforward: no climbing, no playing dead, you fight back as hard and as wild as you can.

[proflytyer]

Back to topic:

 

1) I have seen training videos where spray is used effectively.

2) Was told by my wilderness survival instructor that bells are next to useless, annoy other people, and may mimic the sounds of a marmot or other prey. Alternatively, try singing or talking in loud voices.

3) Only very experienced people who handle guns on a regular basis, i.e. you actually hunt nearly every season, will have the know how to use a gun effectively. Not to mention the question could they use it in a defensive situation and keep their nerve and a steady hand.

 

Hence, I carry spray, an emergency whistle, and a knife (the latter 2 being essential components of a survival kit anyways).

 

Best thing to do is to minimize the times you are in bear dense country and fishing alone. Always best to take a buddy, preferably groups of 3 or 4. Though, admittedly, I have violated that rule numerous times, liking the solitude, and/or not being able to find someone to fish with.

 

Smitty

 

P.S. Kyle; complete agreement about cougars. More afraid of them. They tend to be quieter animals too. At least the defence strategy against cougars is straightforward: no climbing, no playing dead, you fight back as hard and as wild as you can.

 

Smitty,

great to know bear bells are useless. If you dont want to go to the mountains alone, i'll come tag along if possible.

[theboy]

bells do let the bear know something is there though...............

[ironfly]

Average annual Canadian body counts:

 

Cars- 3000

Bears- 1

 

My little 40 lbs dog has treed a half-dozen or so bears in the twelve years we've been adventuring together. He thinks it's great fun. I figure he equates them with really big cats. The best thing about dogs is the early warning system.

 

Bring a dog, carry bearspray. Guns are for hunting, not self-defense.

 

 

[ironfly]

Don't kid yourselves guys, if a bear is stalking, they're as quiet as any other predator. I was once stalked up and down a 200 yard stretch of shoreline. I could smell him, but I never heard a twig snap or a leaf rustle. I know it was a bear beacause I came across his day-bed, and then his lunch.

 

A bit of trivia for ya; both bears and cougars eat the hind legs first, but cougars gut them, bears don't.

 

 

[Smitty]

Junior:

 

Glad you have a well trained dog that doesn't motivate the bear to come after you. But most books I've read and guys I've talked to advise against bringing a dog. Glad to see its worked out for you; but I firmly state that you are in the minority on the dog issue.

 

Folks, lets avoid the misuse and inappropriate application of statistics. The reasons cars kill more people is that many million more people use cars everyday versus the number of people who place themselves in bear country. Of course cars kill more people. They also kill more people than people who die due to tipped vending machines, but that doesn't make the comparison appropriate. There would be something wrong if cars didn't kill more people due to the staggering number of potential incidents and risk with cars. It would be like, if a Wimbledon match went longer than 10 hours, and more than 170 games played. Oh wait...

 

Having a small chance of being killed by a cougar or a bear shouldn't mean you don't take precautions. Do the boy scout thing; be prepared; it just might save your life.

 

Smitty

 

[bigalcal]

I carry an airhorn in bear country and "toot" it every now and then. Don't accidentally kneel on it inside the back of your enclosed truck box. Scared the s##t outta me!!

[ÜberFly]

Actually, no!! They are too quite for them to even hear (there is actual research on this)!!

 

P

 

bells do let the bear know something is there though...............

 

[SilverDoctor]

I never worry about it, treat all wildlife with respect, have had a great many encounters whith bears. I usually leave the area when you see to much "sign". Been mock charged a few times and have shared many a Salmon and Steelhead stretch of water without serious incident. Just don't get to paranoid about wildlife, don't act like prey, as was mentioned you seldom see them. I remember walking a trail in BC back from a lake and encountering a couple of guys writhing on the ground. They saw a bear and unleashed bear spray... into the wind. Took 3 trips back and forth to fetch water before thy could function. So called bear protection can be dangerous, as can firearms in the wrong hands. And as far as bear bells go, I remember reading that bears in Livingstone where attracted to hikers that wore bears and the yummy sandwiches they dropped. Dad taught me to walk with authority in the bush. Be heard and listen. as in all things inattention and inexperience will get you in trouble.

 

I must say the worst problems I have seen where with people with dogs that had poor training.

Dog finds bear

Dog irritates bear.

Dog chases bear.

Dog runs to master.

Multitude of problems develop.

[Guest frypan]

Actually, no!! They are too quite for them to even hear (there is actual research on this)!!

 

P

 

I would appreciate if you could post the research that you are referring to. Bears have some of the best hearing of any predator, this is why you rarely see them up close as they have heard you first. A bear bell could have no negative effect.

[Pipestoneflyguy]

Geez - we sure love this topic - despite the feeling I could cut and paste the same reply every year I see alot of value in this on-going discussion because the key to surviving is being proactive - so much discussion orients around what to do once the bear is encountered, but the reality is, once your at that phase of an interaction, you have already failed and what happens after that is largely out of your hands. If I can offer some observations, use the info as you will....keep in mind I fish in the middle of the most concentrated bear area in the country, I have had more encounters than I could count, I almost always fish alone - and I think about this stuff constantly....especially 5 km in at dusk on darkening trails LOL

 

Feeling like an idiot is OK - I mean that in the context that I often get sideways looks from others I encounter on trails and riversides hiking along yelling "HEY BEAR" repeatedly. It seems, and feels silly to do it, but no one can deny that out of all the multiple bear encouters I have had, they were ALL times that I got lazy and failed to yell "HEY BEAR" as I hiked along.

 

I have been bluff charged - it was scary ! - it all happened so fast there was no time to think, let alone respond. I was alone, and it was my fault (see paragraph above). Before the fact I had a knife, bear spray or bangers even occured to me, the gravel hit my face from the bear high-tailing it back the other way. If I took you to the spot where the bear was drinking water on the edge of the river you would be shocked - I could crouch down in that spot and grab your leg as you went by and you would never see me till it was all over. This is, and was, the exact type of scenario that will get a fly angler killed. Just like the elderly woman killed by a cougar X-country skiing on Minnawanka, the Girl in Canmore who ran and climbed a tree, and the folks in tents in the campground that were attacked about 15 years ago. Pro-active measures preventing the encounter are the only proven effective survival strategy.

 

Bear Bells - I wear two on my pack - do bear bells scare away bears, no, of course not. What they do, is give a bear an opportunity to be aware of your presence, with enough lead time to identify what, or who, you are, from enough of a distance that an involuntary fight or flight response is not provoked. Is this foolproof ? of course not. Will you encounter circumstances in the backcountry where a bear bell may prevent you from surprising a bear - spend enough time out there and I garrantee you will, ...eventually. - the thing with bear bells, is that IF they work as intended, you will never know it. (Would a curious bear come investigate a bell maybe, but curious bears do all kinds of wierd stuff, and that same bear may be just as likely to come investigate you, or your noise or your smell, or your dog, reagrdless of the stats, you are still eliminating the element of surprise from the interaction, and if you don't see the value in that, you simply not giving predators their due respect)

 

Seeing bear tracks on your trail ? - don't freak out. I constantly see bear, cougar, and wolf tracks overlaid over my own - doesn't mean your being tracked - remember, your easist route of travel, is also the easiest route of travel for everything else in the woods too. Just take the extra precautions and make alot of noise. It is almost shocking to me how often I see evidence of a bear I passed by very closely without ever actually seeing it.

 

I saw a suggestion on another board - a fella fires a bear banger at the start of his hike to clear the way - can't knock that, seems like a good idea if you don't mind spending the cash on Bangers. I have bangers and screamers and flares (screamers apparently work best BTW) so far these are the occassions I have used them - 1) every year I start the Sir Norman Watson Stage race with a banger. 2) after scoring a the biggest Pike of our group, flyfishing at Wolf Lake I got drunk and fired all of them off for the fun of it. 3) I carry the kit when on my pontton on big water where I question my ability to swim to shore if my boat sank - Point is that despite all the encouters and situations I have been in, not once, in my judgement, was firing a banger a good idea. If you feel complelled to try it please make sure you shoot either straight up or behind you otherwise risk sending the bear your way.

 

Guns, rifles etc - I saw the post on another board from a guy who was with someone who swung around and shot a cougar as at lept at him from behind, woooo-hoooo !!!! holy hollywood moment !!!! - I don't know the guy or anything but I sure hope to hell I never walk up behind him on a trail. I hunt and I have nothing against folks who want to bear arms but that said, I would refer to my third paragraph - In term of keeping a weapon in Camp, I have no trouble seeing the value in that.

 

I would hope that most folks here share my love of wild places and the creatures they contain, and as such recognize that not taking appropriate precautions, and ending up in a bear/human encounter that provokes an aggresive response from the bear, will most certainly result in a death sentence for the bear (if you report it), if you don't, it could mean a death sentence for the next hiker who comes along.

 

So yes there is value in talking about what to do once in the depths of an encounter, but please try to focus on preventing that scenario in the first place.

 

Frypan - start a thread called "Frypan learns to spell" and then mess around with the spellcheck button till ya figure it out LOL

 

 

[Pipestoneflyguy]

Hey Peter,

 

My bells are loud - and actually a couple times in my natural hunting blind, I rattled them to get a bear away from the meadow I was stalking. A bud and I did some experiments and you can definatly hear the bells before regular level talking (human ears of course). Alot of hikers count on talking so I think they can still be usefull.

 

I know alot of experienced backcountry guys like yourself that hate them. I usually pack them away in places with good visibility - High risk areas (like along most of the pipestone) I do have some confidence in them.

 

Dogs - forgot that one, thanks for mentioning SD- I have been an advocate for "WELL-trained" dogs in the past - I have an elkhound which was originally bred specifically for cornering and holding large undulates - I have always been able to control her completely in front of bears (she has always been intrisically afraid of grizzlies, ears back, walking backwards kinda stuff, but still adhered all commands) - this spring we encountered a bear about 50m away on a steep uphill trail (mud lake) and she totally freaked out and came running behind me - I can only attribute that reaction to her self recognition of her age and strength waining, she is now 12 years old - this really shocked me and to be honest I am now leaving her behind on most riverside hikes. I think, like any decision/action in the back country, one has to be brutally realistic about assessing their dogs capabilities and their own level of owner control. Tough thing when those big sad eyes give me "that look" that all dog owners know, but I am biting the reality bullit on this one, she is just not up to it anymore and I don't want to risk her, or my, safety. (damn - took me six years of work to train her...)

[fishpro]

I've heard that bear bells are less effective than they used to be since bears have learned that they signify people and hence food nearby, so they can actually attract the bears to you.

[ÜberFly]

Rob,

 

I use a BIG cow bell actually (what I'm referring to is the dinky little bells that MEC sells - which I can bearly hear myself [pun intended], but I am getting old LoL!)! I keep it in the tent at night... If something's rustling outside in the middle of the night, that's when I use it!! I had it dangling from my pack once coming down from (South) Molar Pass a few years ago and the people that were coming up said that they could here it from below... Doubt they would have heard one of the dinky little ones...

 

P

[Pipestoneflyguy]

That's scary (fishpro)

 

For that to happen, a person using bells would have had to actually feed a bear. (or allow a bear to be fed, as in leaving food waste behind)

 

Kinda like pretending to cock my fishing rod like a shot gun - I have actually used that action to demonstrate how learned behaviour works (work great in areas like here where bear's typically face a good deal of hazing if they enter human areas)

 

10-4 P - BTW for those reading Princess auto has cheap cow bells various sizes and shapes.

[ÜberFly]

5 x 5 R

 

 

10-4 P