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Shoot down Sutter and you don't know hockey? I disagree. I think he has made some good moves, and some real stinkers - particularly with bringing in some dinosaurs on defense. He let Giordano go to Russia and then signed Hale and Erickson in the same year. And don't get me started on Bert. Its fair for somone to question him. As a scout he has done pretty well. The Flames run in '04 was fantastic. Best time I've had in this city since i got here in '95 ('88 and '89 were probably even more fun). But lets face it - they were an overtime away from being bounced in the first round. Since then, they have underperformed. His Coaching record: Team Year Regular Season Post Season G W L T OTL Pts Finish Result SAG 1988–89 82 46 26 - 10 102 2nd in East Lost in First Round IND 1989–90 82 53 21 - 8 114 1st in West Won Turner Cup CHI 1992–93 84 47 25 12 - 106 1st in Norris Lost in First Round CHI 1993–94 84 39 36 9 - 87 5th in Central Lost in First Round CHI 1994–95 48 24 19 5 - 53 3rd in Central Lost in Third Round SJ 1997–98 82 34 38 10 - 78 4th in Pacific Lost in First Round SJ 1998–99 82 31 33 18 - 80 4th in Pacific Lost in First Round SJ 1999–00 82 35 30 10 7 87 4th in Pacific Lost in Second Round SJ 2000–01 82 40 27 12 3 95 2nd in Pacific Lost in First Round SJ 2001–02 82 44 27 8 3 99 1st in Pacific Lost in Second Round SJ 2002–03 24 9 12 2 1 (73) 5th in Pacific (Fired) CGY 2002–03 46 19 18 8 1 (75) 5th in Northwest Missed Playoffs CGY 2003–04 82 42 30 7 3 94 3rd in Northwest Lost in Stanley Cup final CGY 2005–06 82 46 25 - 11 103 1st in Northwest Lost in First Round CGY 2006-2007 Lost in First Round CGY 2007-2008 Lost in First Round Hardly Scotty Bowman numbers

Of course the web-site has bugs all over it. Anyone actually get it to work?

Birchy - I pity you. As I sat stranded at work last night because I had lost my car keys at some point during the day and couldn't get home, I read your post and thought to myself, glad I'm not like him.

Wow - one tough chick. Hard to believe the first girl wasn't killed. Still - Sweedish twin sisters (Is that wrong?)

iceman - can you give a drop dead date for sign-up? My schedule bounces around, and I likely won't know for sure until next monday whether I'll be in town.

Not trying to be a jerk Weedy - but the only one that seems to be responding is you.

46.9

I like the one about the one that got away. If only I can remember it for next year's fishing extravaganza. Heres one that bcube and toolman might like. A fisherman returned to shore with a giant marlin that was bigger and heavier than he. On the way to the cleaning shed, he ran into a second fisherman who had a stringer with a dozen baby minnows. The second fisherman looked at the marlin, turned to the first fisherman and said... "Only caught one, eh?"

There's an "other"? Or does that imply those folks are abstaining from voting for any of these flakes? If so, i need to change my vote.

A fellow Parrothead. Love Jimmy Buffet - but my wife hates him, so I ONLY listen to him in my car One thing I noticed - most of us have a fairly ecletic mix going - Gregory Isaacs and Poison, mon?

The Council - Recover Local Calgary band that is awesome. The song New York City is one of the best I've heard anywhere and the title track is cool also. They get some play on local radio. Check them out on itunes.

Damn - I had my reply completely typed out, then knocked the off switch on my computer. And what I had written was brilliant, really! bhurt - just wanted to say that sometimes being on the same team as someone you don't like (or don't think you would like) can be pretty interesting. I was in the military years ago and we did alot of exercises and competitions where we got randomly assigned. It was a great way to develop tolerance and also to see someone elses point of view. Not saying you always ended up lifelong pals, but I have friends from those days that couldn't be more different than me. And yes - there were a few slugs thrown, but pretty rare. But - I hear you on the other part of your post. I spent a long time learning how to flyfish. I enjoyed doing things myself and it would have absolutley killed me to ask someone what they were using - but that was just me (I've also never asked for directions). Don't know your history, but if it is any consolation, all of the techniques you've perfected on the Bow will likley be useless in a couple of years anyways :. When I started fishign the Bow in '95 for the first three years I never used anything other than a dark brown Elk Hair Caddis - really - and we slayed them almost every time we went out. Then the river changed and we had to learn new stuff . Anyway - I understand your reluctance to make it too easy for folks that aren't willing to try to figure some things out on their own. I usually try to give people some hints that send them in the right direction, but leave enough out so that when they get it, they can feel some satisfaction. If someone just wants it to be too easy and constantly asks "what fly, what depth, what technique etc." I usually tell them to try figuring it out themselves. Regarding the competition/fundraiser: If I'm in town: I'm in, regardless of what the format and rules are. I'd like to see random teams because there are lots of folks on here that I think I have different views from on various issues, and different backgrounds, but would still enjoy meeting - MTB, bhurt, and a few others to name a few. Any prizes should be awarded randomly, and I don't think too many are required. Maybe go for one or a few bigger prizes. Trophies are a good idea. Largest brown, Largest Rainbow, and most team fish. Two days of fishing might be too much. Fish Saturday and have a BBQ/gasbag session on Sunday.

Best part of that video was the redhead. But times stops for no-one: Tawny Kitaen - probably best known for those smarmy Whitesnake videos and more recently for her stint on VH-1's The Surreal Life - has been charged with felony drug possession after sheriff's deputies said they found cocaine in her apartment. Susan Kang Schroeder, a spokeswoman for the Orange County district attorney's office. said Kitaen is scheduled to be arraigned on December 18 at Harbor Justice Center in Laguna Niguel. Schroeder said on Tuesday that if Kitaen is convicted, her sentence could be as light as attending a drug diversion program or a much harsher sentence which would consist of up to three years in prison. According to authorities, deputies responded to a request for a welfare check in May and found 15 grams of cocaine in Kitaen's San Juan Capistrano apartment. They also said her two children were home at the time and Kitaen had given deputies permission for the search. It wasn't immediately known whether Kitaen had retained a lawyer. The mug shot above was taken n 2002, when Kitaen was arrested on charges of spousal abuse. Her husband at the time, former Angels pitcher Chuck Finley and Kitaen got into a fight and Kitaen beat the hell out of the guy. Finley later dropped the charges after the couple divorced and Kitaen agreed to counseling.

Great fish. I go in the spring around may long-weekend and the banks are loaded with people. I'd prefer that they just make it catch and release. I think there is just too much population too close to the lake to manage it as a 1 over 20". Here's a pic of a a nice rainbow my 9 year old got stripping in a purple leech from shore (it was so $#$%$ windy that I could not row my jon boat accross the lake - everytime he would get a fish, by the time we landed it, we we're back at the boat launch). I was about 50 yards down shore when he hooked it, so just had to let him fight it on his own. When he hooked it, he had about 30 ft of wet line at his feet, and did a great job getting it to the reel. It was quite the thing to watch. He was so excited and had absolutley no problem with a quick pic and then sending this back for someone else to enjoy.

Markets up 7% yesterday, so everyone should be back soon!

I had thought things were improving. When I left Vancouver Island in '95 fishing in the the Staights was really bad. My friends that still live there say it is vastly improved in the past 5 years. Can't argue with the numbers though I guess.

Great Video.

Good discussion (most of it). Guess I've been out of the loop - I had no idea so many people used multiple flies. I tried two on Saturday and didn't have much luck. Went back to one and got a few. My fishing partner used one all day and did pretty well. I also don't use the dry line with strike indicator approach either - and based on the boats I saw on Saturday, that seems to be the predominant method on the river. I used a wet line for nymphing/streamers and dry line only for dry flies. So that may be a better way to fish multiple flies. Although I don't agree with much OO says, I do think that tradition plays some part in what we do (especially etiquette), and one fly seems more traditional (though I have no idea if this is really true). To each his or her own - whatever is legal and you enjoy you should do. I'll probably stick to one fly.

I've always only used one fly on my line, but when I moved to Alberta in the early 90's - saw that some people used two. From posts I've read on this board - it seems very common. I tried it a few times this year and find that casting is not as enjoyable, the lines get tangled, and its a pain to store when your done for the day. And - I've always seemed to do pretty well relative to others with just one fly. Just curious.

Took my 5 wt on a trip to Ottawa few years back. Went west of the city north or Carlton place and absolutley hammered bass all day on an olive wooly bugger and wet line.

Thats just wrong. Your WIN is on your license - so there is no need to have the card. Like my wallet isn't 'Castanza'd up" enough that I need to carry around yet another plastic card. I don't think this guy knew what he was speaking of, cause a WIN is only required to purchase a license (i.e. you don't even have to have a WIN Card as long as you have the number for on-line purchases). If you go to purchase a license for the first time, they give you a WIN immediatley, but you won't get your card for 6 weeks. Does this guy imply that you have to wait 6 weeks to fish. Did you get his name/number? Not that its a big deal, but there should be no 'warning' here. If he said, its a good idea to have it with you, thats fine. I think he is the one thats needs to be issued a warning. As I had a quick look at the regs - I just noticed that you can buy alberta licenses on-line now. I missed that news.

This baby'll get you where you need to go - and has plenty of room in the back. Won't be good if you or any of your family are alergic to shag carpet though.

Couple of points zed (and smitty I guess). I think this is a valid topic for discussion I'm not sure I see anyone bitching about $20/day. What I see are complaints about 1) There is no option for an annual license covering all of the rivers for non BC Canadians, 2) The changes were driven by a small group of partisan stakeholders and were aimed at making the rivers more exclusive - not at protecting the fishery - and without proper public consultation and debate before they went in (including consulting the public in the areas around the affected rivers), and 3) The regs are not equitable. The article is 4 years old - well, so are the regs. So I think it speaks to the real rationale behind the changes, not the revisionist version that has since emerged. To quote the author, Mark Hume, "Many of B.C.’s best waters are getting crowded. And most of the crowding, at least on the Elk, Wigwam and other southeastern rivers, is coming from Alberta. For those of us who’ve lived in B.C. a lifetime that’s a bit perturbing." But then, in the same article, the author states: "On the Elk River licensed commercial guides and assistants have increased from 9, in 1995, to 52 in 2002." Hmm - the guides were local, no? Regarding his statement on the source of the crowding (ALBERTA): Creel surveys suggested that angling pressure had increased ten-fold since the early 1980s, and that almost 80% of anglers surveyed originated from outside the province - 49% from the US and 28% from Alberta. That would suggest about 23% from BC and 28% from Alberta. This sounds about right given the location of the Elk to Alberta population centers. BC has some excellent regulations that were all in place place well in advance of these changes - catch and release, bait-ban, slot limits, barbless etc. But as even Dave Brown said: "In the process he [the author of an article] has attempted to draw the readership of Fly Fisherman into the very confusing realm of good-old-boy B.C. politics, where a minority of local anglers and outfitters feel that they should be able to roll back the clock to the days before "The Movie" and introduce measures that would deter anglers from outside the province from accessing these resources." This was from a letter to Flyfishing magazine in response to an article talking about over-pressure on the Elk (don't have the date - but I believe it was shortly before the new regs came in). Note - for earlier posts where the local guides were placed in one category - that might not have been fair to Dave and any other local guides who might not have been fully on board with these new regs. Don't know where he stands on this, but his statement would suggest he would not support this. Finally - and I promise I'll let this drop (for now ) - wanted to say that I had a great week-end on the river. Best part was that I met some other fishermen - one from Elkford who was super-nice even after he saw the plate on our truck. I never once got the feeling that he had any problems whatsoever with Albertans. Also met some folks from Calgary there who went out of there way to be friendly at the rec site. Shared some stories and beverages, and even discussed these regs (I think they would vote no). The week-end is was pretty much a mirror image of a trips taken up to 2004 as far as fish #s, size, number of other groups etc, which is yet another reason I question the what the new regs intended to do. Final note - caught two cut-bows in one hole, without checking the throat would have sworn they were full rainbows.

I guess I have to use more emoticons. Hard as it is to believe - some of you couldn't figure out that I was joking about the sales tax idea. And in case it hasn't been said enough - this has nothing to do with whether $20 is a fair amount to fish those waters. But - enough said. Looks like the vast majority feel these regs are not fair.

You're right Keith. I think a few people have pointed out that crying about this is not good enough. To me the only thing worse than crying about this is not crying about it. MTB - principal is important to me, not BS. I think a few approaches have been taken so far and failed - but perhaps because they focussed on only fishing reciprocity. Maybe we should focus on reciprocity of unjust application of discriminatory conduct. How about we impose a sales tax on all British Columbians when they drive into Calgary and load up on tax free stuff? It wouldn't really add much to our revenue, and it likely wouldn't stop them from coming - but it would be fair according to their rationale, and be a real nuisance. After all, it is Albertan income tax payers that pay enough tax to negate the need for a provincial sales tax. Also - have you seen how busy the malls are lately? And I've seen BC plates in the parking lot - so it must be those damn BC people coming into our province to spend money (how dare they?). We must figure out a good method to get rid of 'em so that our malls can be emptier and we can enjoy a day of non-combative shopping. Well - that's just a first idea. I'll try to come up with some others