DonnieM Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 I don't care what anyone says, bear spray works, its not costly and its an investment in your life. Watch this guys story and then tell me otherwise, or what you would have done with no bear spray..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TA_DXeWTOG8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newflyer Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 I have spent a fair amount of time in the bush and seen my fair share of bears aswell - so far so good knock on wood. I think that we are losing the point of this post - some poor guy got attacked by a bear. It doesn't matter if he did everything 'correctly' or not - he got attacked by a bear. We should be worried about him. That could have been anyone of us regardless of our percieved 'skills' in bear encounters. Every situation and every bear is different and they will react different to every situation. I find it kinda sad that we use this situation to talk about how great we are in the woods... Heres hoping that it is never someone on this board in a story like what was presented at the begining of these posts. my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikefromsundre Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 I have spent a fair amount of time in the bush and seen my fair share of bears aswell - so far so good knock on wood. I think that we are losing the point of this post - some poor guy got attacked by a bear. It doesn't matter if he did everything 'correctly' or not - he got attacked by a bear. We should be worried about him. That could have been anyone of us regardless of our percieved 'skills' in bear encounters. Every situation and every bear is different and they will react different to every situation. I find it kinda sad that we use this situation to talk about how great we are in the woods... Heres hoping that it is never someone on this board in a story like what was presented at the begining of these posts. my two cents. Thank you Aquaholic you said it more politely than I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowcane Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 Yup, speedy recovery to this guy. Bears can be any where. Two weeks ago I stopped for a whiz in Seebe down at the Bow and a black bear popped out of the brush about 50' away from me. Fortunately being originally from Northern Ontario it really wasn't a concern to me. However staying in town isn't safe either, as I'd rather deal with the four legged animals than the two legged ones spray painting graffiti on bridges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strand Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 to all those reading this post, please accept my appologies. my words were definetly harsh. ive been living and working in the sticks for 2 decades and it seems to me there have been more maulings in the past recent years than ever before. after reading what has been said, i realize that most of you are taking the precautions necessary to stay alive out here. however more and more in-experienced people are coming to the woods and thinking nothing of survival. as for the 23 year old who thinks i fish at the zoo, you were just let off your leash. i cant imagine you have as much experience and knowledge as you think you do. with that said, i hope this guy has a speedy recovery and the only experts on bear encounters are either dead or in the hospital. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Whatever girls... the wounds say he was runnin', he has abso-frickin'lutely no defensive wounds and the cardinal rule of close proximity blackbear encounters, (least the one I was taught).. never run, standup to the bastard and if a bear scratchin' is inevitable, fight like hell, most blackbears are basically chickenshit. That would put the wounds on my frontside not my ass. I wonder how many Wildlife Enforcement Officer manhours are going to be wasted tracking down and destroying an asschewin' blackbear instead of real work... somehow the poaching of wildlife comes to mind. Ain't no sympathy here, you'll have to find it in your copy of Websters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orvisonly Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 On bearspray. The only guy that ever did a real study on effectiveness: "During his 16 years of field work Smith has never had cause to use the spray himself - proof that using caution and knowing what you are dealing with is the best deterrent of all. Indeed Smith believes that one of the key reasons that the spray works is that it stops the user from running a way - a bad move when faced with bear attack." I Don't know the circumstances of buddy that got it on the Dogpound - but, alone in the bush and running from a bear ain't smart. I got no sympathy for an idiot who kills himself on a motorbike because he was a noob that had no idea what he was doing. Then my gf starts giving me the gears about how dangerous my bike is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedy1 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Bear spray is nonsense, all you have to do is threaten them with the trampoline treatment and they'll run like hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I've got a friend who a retired Parks Warden. He has absolute faith in pepper spray, he's used it a total of 4 times on aggressive grizzlies and each time it was like the bear ran into a wall. Aggressive blackbears he just smacked with a stick. Like the trampoline treatment though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DutchDryfly Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Whatever girls... the wounds say he was runnin', he has abso-frickin'lutely no defensive wounds and the cardinal rule of close proximity blackbear encounters, (least the one I was taught).. never run, standup to the bastard and if a bear scratchin' is inevitable, fight like hell, most blackbears are basically chickenshit. That would put the wounds on my frontside not my ass. I wonder how many Wildlife Enforcement Officer manhours are going to be wasted tracking down and destroying an asschewin' blackbear instead of real work... somehow the poaching of wildlife comes to mind. Ain't no sympathy here, you'll have to find it in your copy of Websters. Taeke, Could you explain to an ingnorant city-tourist why everybody talks about fighting off the bear, where every manual given to tourists in the NP's are stating that if being attacked by a bear the best option is play dead? Rob (no bears exists over here) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Taeke, Could you explain to an ingnorant city-tourist why everybody talks about fighting off the bear, where every manual given to tourists in the NP's are stating that if being attacked by a bear the best option is play dead? Rob (no bears exists over here) I suppose Rob; it's Parks Canada politically correct generic answer for the average National Parks tourist. Confront the wrong bear and you're liable to have a touri who looks like he fell into a paper shredder. Same with running in a panic, big bear will mark you up from the shoulder blades down then bite your head off, little bear will mark you up from the asscheeks down in an attempt to hamstring you Do what you think is best, most of all, educate yourself. The advice I took to heart comes from people who spent a lifetime outdoors in bear country. BTW I never carry a firearm anymore when fishing in grizzly country, only the biggest can of pepper spray I can find. And those of you who are busily lookin' up the word sympathy in the Webster's dictionary...... you'll find it somewhere between *hit and Syphilis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DutchDryfly Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Thanks for explaining this, Taeke. First time I visited I was told that seeing a bear would not happen too often and my chance of seeing one when visiting three weeks would be zero. Well, I guess they never have dealt with a flyfisher, because on all my visits I encountered bears. At least four every visit, but I never got in trouble. I just leave the area when a bear shows up and make lots of noise when travelling in the woods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgo Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 NEVER play dead with a black bear he'll eat you, fight him off if slowly moving away doesn't work and he attacks you. Grizzly will MAYBE leave you alone after an attack, intent is not to eat you really. Sometyimes they come back later I think. A grizzly will kick your ass in most instances, so get down in a ball and cover your head and face face is what I've been told. I'm no expert but I've been told by those who are thats what I should d differently with each kind of bear. Definately fight off a cougar if you can, make yourself look big and mean again if slowly trying to exit the situation doesnn't work. Don't turn your back, and like Taeke said the last thing you do with any of these animals is run. Thanks for explaining this, Taeke. First time I visited I was told that seeing a bear would not happen too often and my chance of seeing one when visiting three weeks would be zero. Well, I guess they never have dealt with a flyfisher, because on all my visits I encountered bears. At least four every visit, but I never got in trouble. I just leave the area when a bear shows up and make lots of noise when travelling in the woods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dube Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 It seems I never learn, discussions on internet forums rarely lead to anything constructive but for discussions sake what does everyone else think about playing dead. I would say that most bears this time of year are all about conserving energy and finding food. I can't see a bear making a move to take down a large mammal with a meal in mind, more a territory issue or you caught them by surprise. However a bear would most definitely eat a large mammal if it were lying there dead. I figure while you are laying there playing dead you may feel some large chunks of meat being torn off your legs. Further I figure it would take a lot more resolve to try and be still and loose (like a dead person) than to actually stand up and try to fight. In my case I know with all certainty that I could never just lay there and hope it stops the assault. You would be getting tossed like a rag doll. I've also heard to just turtle up and try and protect your head and neck with your hands but you have large organs that are not too far into your ribs along your back which seems like it would be a very bad mistake as a bear would naturally get it's claws into you to try and roll you over. I believe that playing dead or trying to make yourself small and covering you neck will only prolong an attack. These are my options/plan as it stands: (first I'd like to add that I figure in most cases the bear can smell you and knows you are there unless you happen to be downwind which is some-thing to think about if you spot one) -if I see one and figure it hasn't seen me I'd go fish a different spot -if I see one and it's looking right at me I'd stand tall and talk to it firmly. In my experience at this point most bears will head for cover in the trees, I generally stay put because they can cover ground fast and may circle around to get a better sniff and if you've split after you see it go into the bush you may end up having a much closer encounter than the first. (this has been the extent of my bear encounters and I have gone back to fishing after being satisfied that the bear couldn't be bothered although it can be hard to shake the feeling that they are right there watching you) -if a bear ever comes at me I'll start jumping up and down yelling while going for my spray and as soon as the turd hits my shorts I'll let her rip and hope to hell the statistics on bear spray are close and that I don't make the fatal move of getting it in my own face. -next is the butt section of my 4 pc thrust forward in a hail mary attempt to puncture the chest -if I actually get tackled then my knife is my last resort and I will fight like a crazy bastard and hope for the best. Now I do realize that this can all happen in roughly 4 secs and I know it seems unlikely that I'd be doing a mental checklist during that time but still I've ran it through my head enough times and I'd still like to have any plan than no plan at all. 4 secs is not long to throw one together on the spot. I think thats how run happens, in a heartbeat and with our natural response flight is probably the go to move. I'm going to fight and that is all there is to it. As an aside how about a digit in the rectum? The bears not your own. I've heard it can work with dogs. Totally off topic but with cougars you must fight those bastards and that is all there is to that. They are pussies and don't want to mess their coat up too much so you have a good shot if it doesn't get you by the neck to begin with. I've heard old trappers tell stories of catching big cats by their little toes literally. A coyote will chew off it's friggen leg but a lynx won't move if there is a single tuft of hair caught in a trap. Just to be clear I'm not trying to educate anyone this is simply how it runs through my brain. Tidbits from folks who are older than me and personal experience. Here's hoping we all can keep it to just a philosophy and not a first hand experience. Resume flinging poop now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trailhead Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 From my perspective I think he did try to play dead. The woman jogger who was mauled by a black bear earlier this summer by Lake Louise also tried to play dead and the black bear bit her on the back of the legs and arms. Sounds similiar, only she fought the bear off as soon as it started to bite. Yeah I feel for the guy, but I have buddy who told me a couple of years ago that he doesn't fish the Dogpound because he and his father ran into a very aggressive black bear there. I make noise and wear bells and carry spray when I fish the 'pound' I still catch fish and I have never run into a bear there. As far as more run ins with bears goes, I think it's a reflection of the increased reporting more than an increase of encounters. The locals in most rural areas still shoot, shovel and shutup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hydropsyche Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I'm just wondering where in this article it said he was a fat assed city slicker. I've read it a few times and still can't find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogpound Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I live on the dogpound, East of HWY 22. The F&W officers probably know exactly where that bear went, right back to the Water Valley Dump. Bears are always at that dump and the Golfcourse. I have hunted and fished in the bush for many years, I am always more careful/wary around black bears, they are too use to humans and are not that scared, makes it pretty easy to get yourself into a compromising position. Most of my encounters/sightings with grizzlies in the bush is usually their back end. Most of the Dogpound downstream from Bottrel to SR 582 is Buck-brush (willow), its thick, muffles sound and prey & predators really enjoy it for cover. I was almost trampled by a cow moose once. On a side note - a Cougar was killed on my quarter about 5 years ago, I am approximately 6 miles EAST of HWY 22. There is another that frequents the area however no sightings since early spring. Be careful and mindful of your surroundings at all times. As one poster has said, better chance of dying from West Nile Virus than bear/cougar attack. If you are fishing alone, make lots of noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyaleddie Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Bear spray is light, very effective, not costly and works 99.99% of the time. Its an investment in your life. As for the cow bell there is absolutely nothing wrong with that tactic either and good on yah for using one. I lived in Canmore for many years and pretty much everyone I know in the climbing community out there uses a bell of some sorts as well as bear spray, the key is to not surprise the bear, but to let him or her know that you are coming and are in the area. Good luck to all and a quick recovery to our brother in rods with his leg injury. You guys are Completely missing the point...... MORE COW BELL!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Yeah you win Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyaleddie Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Yeah you win Matt What were we playing for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trailhead Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I just talked to a fellow downtown who told me the guy attacked is a good friend of his, and he stated it wasn't a black bear but instead was a yearling dark colored grizzly. Apparently the fellow saw the bear and slowly started to back up, the bear then went back into the bush, circled around and ambushed him. This wasn't in the papers so it can't be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birchy Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I just talked to a fellow downtown who told me the guy attacked is a good friend of his, and he stated it wasn't a black bear but instead was a yearling dark colored grizzly. Apparently the fellow saw the bear and slowly started to back up, the bear then went back into the bush, circled around and ambushed him. This wasn't in the papers so it can't be true. Yikes! That's a bit on the scary side! Did this guy mention is his friend is healing up pretty good? Hope so.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trailhead Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Yeah he said he is doing well. Doesn't fault the bear either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbowtrout Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 I hit the dogpound last night and the spot I normally go to was closed off with yellow fish n wildlife tape. So I take it this is where it happened. So me being a dumb ass I just fished the other way where there was no tape The fishing was great and no signs of bears but the :$*%&: beaver that scared me must still be laughing his ass off. Anyway while I was in there and having every little sound scare me and wondiring why am I doing this for a few trout I was thinking with this thick brush and steep banks there is no way in hell you could run from a bear if it came at you so that would leave you with two options fight or play dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SanJuanWorm Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Chris if I were a bear and I saw a face like yours, i'd run the other way uber fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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