CopperJonny Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuseR1aYsDc Look at what happens when some put down the playstation controller!!! I get that its no different than a slaughter house.. but these are wild endangered fish, and are killed indiscriminately Quote
pipercub17 Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 ............brutal ...........makes me sick ! Quote
Fishslayer74 Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 Wow is that ever disturbing. Couldn't even watch it all. Quote
Guest Stillcreek Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 I would assume it's a native fishery. No diffrent than the fish traps I've seen from the Queen Charlottes to Oregon when I commercially fished. I'm sure it regulated. Quote
DiabeticKripple Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 It's legal. The only thing I mind is them jumping on the body of the fish bruising the meat. Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 Ah yes, the stewards of the land, keepers of the sacred salmon..... Quote
shaps21 Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 Good to see it's being kept traditional... Quote
ironfly Posted September 28, 2012 Posted September 28, 2012 From what I've read on other forums, where guys with local knowledge weigh in, these are 95-99% hatchery fish. If they want to tenderize their fish, let them. And it is pretty traditional, actually. People wove nets and strung them to wooden hoops, long before Europeans came to North America. Weirs and fish traps are even more ancient. Quote
CopperJonny Posted September 28, 2012 Author Posted September 28, 2012 If one choose's to keep it traditional, rather than buck up to help this engine run like every other human... or should i say native of the same damn planet... no different than anyone else... then i say... sure...but you do it traditionally!!! With traditionally woven the nets.. no high powered rifles! Strings and sticks (recurve not compound) no quads! no sleds!! Dugout canoes, birch bark what have you........ and don't forget horses aren't included... horses where brought here by the spanish! We are ALL native's of the earth! And have ALL had to evolve into modern society! not by choice! By force at one time or another! Time to get over it and pitch in! Laws and rules are for everyone! Or no one! There is not an ounce of respect, given to the source of the food! And if you watch it... not one of them look for an adipose fin!! Besides... Hatchery fish are a "New World" scheme" this, this is not tradition.... which would have ended by the time the hatchery fish were needed...time to evolve like the rest of us native earth people! I'm so sick and tired of this, I can hardly reason about it anymore! And No! I'm not going to be biased here either! This is a mini example of commercial fisheries as well! Yes I hunt, and fish! But I do it respectfully, and for food! And if I don't get one this year! Then I go without! Unless you live in "Remote" areas, and Van Isle is far from remote! Either way , this kind of behaviour is far from acceptable from anyone!! 1 Quote
ironfly Posted September 29, 2012 Posted September 29, 2012 In my mind, the only way you can say in fairness that First Nations should conduct their harvest in a perfectly pre-colonial manner, is if you also suggest that the land be returned to a pre-colonial state, and everyone else packs up and leaves. 1 Quote
LeeAB Posted September 29, 2012 Posted September 29, 2012 It would be nice if some of those Coho could have been caught on the fly and released before they ended up being bonked but everything seemed inside the rules. No habitat destruction, no lower food chain destruction,.....looks like they are doing a better job than what's happening in our Eastern slopes. So how is that fracking and coal bed methane extraction going these days? On a side note, saw about a hundred Pinks bonked and on the shores of the Campbell this year at the Sandy pool. Same as last year and the year before and the year before. Quote
CopperJonny Posted September 29, 2012 Author Posted September 29, 2012 In all fairness... that would include First Nation's as well!!... humans (All Men and Women) originated in Africa!! Science and history proves that! We all originated from the same two ancestors.. Not one on this continent, and another on that continent over there.. It just doesn't sit right with me, when everyone's ancestors were forced to live a way they didn't want too, when the "king's men came and booted in the door", when the "horde's of Viking's" or the "Khan's army pillaged our village" and now they "own" the lands... It happened everywhere! To everyone a-lives ancestors... this wasn't a decision... this wasn't something somebody wanted to do for fun... this was evolution.... just the same as we grew long legs to cover great distances... as the birds bones grew hollow, feathers developed and they started flight... the fish grew fins and gills an developed ways to breathe in salt and fresh water... There is not enough room in one house for everyone on this board to sleep, there was at first, yet it grew...so what do we do? We build another over there! Look at what happens in the winter, when all of the deer perish due to starvation! Each field may only support so many in a herd! Just a metaphor... maybe a bad one, yet all the same! So what do we do? What should've we done? Drown ourselves to a population sizeable enough to stay where we were? Or do the exact same thing the first nations did when they found the America's, and move here due to enough land, plenty of room... I mean the Earth is only so big! Shall we pay for that too? Or shall we accept it, and move on with our lives?! They say one road to happiness is to let go of the past! We all have to at some point, wether its us personally or our fathers/mothers, or Grandfathers/Mothers... Yep!! We're definitely overpopulated! What can we do about it! I'll tell you what I think,... in the near future nothing will be done about it! Their will be a time when many of us perish due to disease and filth brought on by ourselves, being overpopulated, too much waste in one place... its Biology! Its what happens. Do we want it to happen, of course not.. but its nature... not choice! Unless we really start to restrain ourselves, against what gives us the most physical pleasure (and i really can't see that happening) we are screwed! ( funny how that is... the pleasure part!) If H-bombs don't do us in, I'm sure that will... so who do we blame for that?Our kids? 'Cause they won't be able to keep their drawr's up!? It's just ridiculous, and by continuing to segregate our own species is promoting problems... we all have to work together in preserving our planet, and home... GD the fellas who created the almighty metal and paper that is more valuable to life than water and oxygen! .....Please pardon me for digressing and going on... I feel everyone should be treated the same way... and this video put a bad taste in my mouth no matter who did it 1 Quote
Guest Sundancefisher Posted October 2, 2012 Posted October 2, 2012 Fished just off the Capilano River last week. Charter captain was not happy. Apparently an early run of Chinooks used to go up that river and were all wiped out by the natives. Now they stocked a later running strain that seem to be fairing a bit better. The only way the fish make it past is if the river blows out with high waters from heavy rain. Quote
sstoyberg Posted October 2, 2012 Posted October 2, 2012 It would be nice if some of those Coho could have been caught on the fly and released before they ended up being bonked but everything seemed inside the rules. No habitat destruction, no lower food chain destruction,.....looks like they are doing a better job than what's happening in our Eastern slopes. So how is that fracking and coal bed methane extraction going these days? On a side note, saw about a hundred Pinks bonked and on the shores of the Campbell this year at the Sandy pool. Same as last year and the year before and the year before. Not sure what that has to do with bonking Coho? Quote
ironfly Posted October 3, 2012 Posted October 3, 2012 A charter captain said that, eh? I'm shocked. On the one hand I hear this has been going on for many years. On the other, we are told that no fish make it past. It is not possible for both of these to be true. Unless these are all hatchery fish, in which case it's no different to me than someone taking their limit of 5 trout from the local pothole. It's a healthy fishery, I'm told, yet the Squamish are supposedly wiping out whole runs, virtually overnight? Maybe, but I'm inclined to think that large seine nets had more to do with it. Quote
Flash Posted October 11, 2012 Posted October 11, 2012 Hey that looks way more effective than flyfishing! You really have to admire the ingenuity of construction of their fish trap too and the way it incorporates shopping carts in the construction. No doubt these were donated by the local grocery store or thoughtfully purchased for this purpose by the tribal council. It is their right under treaty and I guess that somehow makes it OK. Furthermore I suppose that the only difference between this and what regularly occurs on the high seas is that we can see this happening. What pisses me off are the many Vancouver residents who encourage this practice by continuing to engage in the illegal purchase of these discount salmon. Quote
flyfishtara Posted November 3, 2012 Posted November 3, 2012 That was brutal to watch. I don't like seeing that. They could have been much more humane. I don't think Aboriginals are any more ignorant and disrespectful then white folk though. There is a lot of judgement around Aboriginals and I have been guilty of it at times too so I'm not gonna add my thoughts on it other then to say yes, there is a time to move on but any civilization that has had their rights and traditions forcibly taken from them will take several generations to adapt. They were never allowed to assimilate. If your ever interested in seeing a different view on aboriginal issues look up Dr. Gabor Mate. His website offers a handful of videos you can stream. He did a series called "civilized to death", it's short but to the point and attempts to explain a different side to the story in a brief format. He actually speaks a lot about various issues, causes of addiction, parenting, abuse and the connection between health and health yata yata. He is a brilliant brilliant man. I'm in love with his brain! Sorry a little off topic but kinda relevant since the thread walked into aboriginal issues. Quote
Flyfisher Posted November 4, 2012 Posted November 4, 2012 Would Canadians in the general population behave any differently had they the same rights to fish as first nations do? I really, really doubt it. These types of video clips are tiresome... Quote
ArsenalFan Posted November 4, 2012 Posted November 4, 2012 A few Natives clubbing their legal limit doesn't bother me at all. I think some people need to take a Native studies course. Looks to me like they wanted to get em out and club them as fast as possible so they didn't suffer. I hope they filled their freezer. I deal with Natives all the time and they are the most honest people out there. Quote
CopperJonny Posted November 4, 2012 Author Posted November 4, 2012 I think your all missing the point!! Its pure discrimination!! 100% nothing more nothing less than... each and every person on this planet is as "aboriginal" as the next... 2012 in Canada, below the 60th parallel absolutely unnecessary for subsistence living! "Legal Limit" ?!? Wow, ...... Really!? Obviously, some people need to make some Native friends and see "what really goes on"!! And most definitely ask them, they'll tell you. It's ok miss the point! Quote
ArsenalFan Posted November 4, 2012 Posted November 4, 2012 No Copper. Your redneck ass is missing the point. Your whole pitch about discrimination is laughable and insensitive towards our Native population and forum posters. You sound like a Mitt Romney supporter who likes to crank the Ted Nugent on your vacation days away from the oilpatch. Quote
CopperJonny Posted November 4, 2012 Author Posted November 4, 2012 Actually Arse, my "redneck ass" loves some Ted Nugent.... The "hidden" point you are obviously missing is that my thread is about integration, not segregation which leads to Discrimination! Myself, I am much more Liberal, than Conservative.... btw.. this is Canada... so pull your head out of the US' ass why don't you and focus on issues at home! Yet thank you for your comment. This BS about discrimination, goes both ways... always... can't have one without the other! We are of the same gene's or species what have you... everyone follow the same rules, is my point. Move forward, not backwards is the only way to go .... by allowing these treaties with Reservations, one time payouts etc to continue to exist generations later... IS PROMOTING discrimination!! This in fact is also enabling unlimited slaughter by individuals to prevail. Which was the original concern with my initial and utter disgust to seeing this youtube video! Let's not get sidetracked a month or two later Also as I have previously stated, is not any different than commercial netting... as mentioned above, this in my opinion also has to end. Most of us can probably count on a single hand how far back in generations it happened to us. And if not, well... we've got another one.. and that should do it! So this hopeless romantic notion, of treating some with special rules, or not... due to the year our ancestor's arrived here... May have been good initially, have not any relevance this day in age! Apparently some choose to not see the obvious.. Quote
Melitta Posted November 12, 2012 Posted November 12, 2012 Fished just off the Capilano River last week. Charter captain was not happy. Apparently an early run of Chinooks used to go up that river and were all wiped out by the natives. Now they stocked a later running strain that seem to be fairing a bit better. The only way the fish make it past is if the river blows out with high waters from heavy rain. Does your charter captain practise a lot of catch and release? no sharing limits? assigned rods? whole lotta finger pointing going on Quote
Jayhad Posted November 12, 2012 Posted November 12, 2012 Fished just off the Capilano River last week. Charter captain was not happy. Apparently an early run of Chinooks used to go up that river and were all wiped out by the natives. Now they stocked a later running strain that seem to be fairing a bit better. The only way the fish make it past is if the river blows out with high waters from heavy rain. Maybe it was the massive damn the white folks put in that has no possibilty for adequate fish passage that caused the down fall of the once great Capilano salmon and steelhead runs. I think the First Nations people were managing the resource just fine until then. 1 Quote
yakfisher Posted December 2, 2012 Posted December 2, 2012 No Copper. Your redneck ass is missing the point. Your whole pitch about discrimination is laughable and insensitive towards our Native population and forum posters. You sound like a Mitt Romney supporter who likes to crank the Ted Nugent on your vacation days away from the oilpatch. redneck ass? can you understand the language he is using. I stumbled on this post accidentally (I have used this site once before) and I could see very quickly that Copper is probably quite educated or at the least very worldly. His standpoint is actually very forward and the opposite of "redneck". A global population, global government and a global economy is starting to become what this planet needs. it is very apparent when you look at different native populations around the world that stick to prehistoric customs that they are damaging and archaic and need to go. I pose this question to you. What do you think of the clubbing of a baby seal in the arctic? Or the de-finning of sharks and throwing them back in the water just so the fins can be harvested for soup in chinese culture? or cannibalism in Amazonian tribes, or the hunting of whales, or the killing of dolphins? I can go on and on with all of the terrible things being done on this planet in the name of "traditional customs". I agree that you should never forget your heritage and keep the customs alive that make a person unique in this quickly shrinking planet. but when these customs have impacts on the health of the ecosystem or the population as a whole, it isn't relevant in our society and needs to be abolished. Also as he has said, every culture throughout time has been oppressed in some way. I am scottish, my home lands were occupied by the british for hundreds of years where they raped and pillaged our lands and stole taxes from us that they didn't deserve (I learnt that from watching Braveheart lol). Or How about african americans? if you want to talk about the most recent reppression of a race, they are it. Are they fighting for tax breaks, recieving free education from the government. No, of course they aren't. Modern society owes nothing to these cultures that were damaged ages ago, like copper said; Laws are for all men or no one. my rant is done now too. Quote
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