Are Bass Tougher Than Trout?

[Garlicmarshmellow]

I was having lunch with a group at Chilis and watching a fishing show with the hosts initials I L. He was catching bass and landing them using what looked not to be a rubber net and stood there talking while holding the fish. I even said out loud a couple of times" Put the fish back". While leaving I counting 2 times amount of time the fish were out of the water. Near 27 steamboats. Bass might be tougher, maybe not, but this is no way to handle fish on a network show. Land the fish, release it, then talk. Boo brother quartz to that host and no he wasn't flyfishing.

[maxwell]

that is a common theme on alot of fishing shows dude.. totally unreal.. the biggest thing that bugs me about fishing show and some magazines is alot of people see this and figure "because the pros do it its alright" and that is how some anglers get bad fish handling habits..

[jack]

Bass probably are more resilient than rainbow trout, as far as living environment is concerned. They certainly are comfortable in a much wider range of water temperatures, in much lower oxygen content(might explain the extended out of water thing) and in water with a much higher organic suspension content.

 

And yes, I agree that the handling of bass on TV shows is a disservice to fish handling of other species.

j

[flyfishfairwx]

Watch some of the FlyMAX vids and some of the ones posted on this BB and you will see bad fish handling, out of water way too long, big fish dipped, that means dipped back in the water then up for somebody else to take a picture, and dipped for a picture, head way down or way up and way up above the water. On one recent home made vid I saw finger prints on the belly of a big fish when it was released, that the host was so happy to get and was saying "not a mark on him"

 

Saw some guys I have fished with, man handle a large B trout, much longer then the rules allow!!

 

I respect these(this) guy and it was a great fish all the more reason to let it go as fast as possible..

 

This is a pet peeve of mine..some of the "pros" have a camera guy with them but lots of regular folk don't and they try to get the hero shot, NOT NECESSARY! you beat the fish, landed him, now let him or her, go as fast as possible.

 

This is the resource we all love so much, treat it gingerly so that it can be around to make more big fish and for our kids kids to catch..

 

Don't blame me for this rant you guys opened the door!!!

 

Before anybody starts , yea I have been guilty in the past, and now do a hell of a lot better!

[Guest 420FLYFISHIN]

trout are sissy school children compared to Bass. Those fish take a lick'in and keep on kick'en. We have a rock bass problem at the lake where my cottage is and it sometimes takes 2 or 3 wackes of the the side of the boat to kill em.

 

trout are fun and all but nothing compared to a bass.

 

P.S. I agree with your statement about holding them out of the water too long, a fish is a fish and should be kept in the water.

[alhuger]

 

I am as guilty as the next guy about grip and grin photos. However, I find on home water I really rarely photograph anything and I have to think that helps overall. I generally now only photograph the fish if there something really memorable about it or I caught it in water I rarely get to and want to remember it. I know when I started I photographed everything and I mean everything. I guess I was still pretty impressed I could catch a fish period.

 

 

Cheers

al

[Harps]

The best pictures are of fish in and near their natural environment...

 

Bass are tougher than trout in the sense that they live in warmer, less oxygen rich environments and can withstand longer periods out of the water (like Jack said). They still die due to angler mishandling, and there are many reports on panfish C&R from the US that indicate that. They are also suceptable to population harm when the fishing season is open while they are on their nests. Big bass pulled off nests= a lost generation. They are aggressive while defending their territory and are easily angled.

 

BTW

Fishing show hosts aren't shining examples of how to handle fish... or how to follow the regulations.

Just looking at most FF mags will show you that we need more education on how to handle our resource...

 

I read a good quote this morning that sums it up:

"Take care of the Fish, and the Fishing will take care of itself."

-Art Neumann, former TU president

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/1998/04/16/fish980416a.html

(and a number of writeups from online:

The Toronto Star reports two television fishing stars have been fined after pleading guilty to snagging fish in the Trent River.

Henry Waszczuk and Italo Labignan, hosts of Canadian Sportfishing; broadcast weekly on TSN, were fined a total of $1,800 and will be meeting with network executives about the consequences of the convictions.

 

The 13-year television fishing experts were each ordered to pay $800 on one count of using a hook to snag whitefish in body parts other than the mouth.

 

Waszczuk, 47, and Labignan, 41, snagged as many as 30 fish Nov. 6, 1995, hooking them in the body so they could re-hook them in the mouth and film their retrieval, court heard. Labignan also pleaded guilty to another charge of failing to release a lake trout and was fined an additional $200.

 

Rick Brace, president of TSN, admitted the fines could hurt the integrity of fishing shows.

Crown Attorney George Archer dropped five remaining charges against them.

 

Another TV fishing host, Karen Monaghan, 37, of The Natural Angler (which used to air on WTN) was found guilty of snagging whitefish, then re-hooking them for camera purposes. She was also fined $800.

 

Waszczuk, a former CFL center for the Hamilton Tiger Cats, faces two more court appearances in Burlington and in Peterborough on charges of fishing in a sanctuary and taking bass during a closed season.

CRTC, April 1998:

Canadian Sportfishing host Henry Waszczuk has been fined

$800 in Peterborough court for fishing out of season. The TSN

personality was charged with catching 10 bass before the

season opened...

 

April 3, 1998

 

Two Men Fined A Total Of $1,800 For Fishing Violations

Italo Labignan, 41, of Freelton, Ontario and Henry Waszczuk, 47, of Burlington, Ontario were fined a total of $1,800 today on three charges under the Ontario Fishery Regulations.

 

Labignan and Waszczuk pleaded guilty to a joint charge of using a hook in a manner to hook whitefish in body parts other than in the mouth. They appeared in Ontario Court (Provincial Division) in Trenton. Labignan also pleaded guilty to a charge under the regulations of failing to release a fish in a manner that caused the least harm to the fish and was fined $200. Labignan and Waszczuk are the hosts of a television show, Canadian Sportfishing.

 

Conservation Officers from the Ministry of Natural Resources investigated the two men's fishing activities after receiving a complaint. During the investigation, COs seized a number of video tapes. The tapes, along with other evidence, showed the two men as they were videotaped fishing for whitefish in the Trent River in Trenton on November 6, 1995 using a fishing lure commonly called a jig. They caught a number of whitefish, and with the possible exception of one or two fish, the fish were hooked in parts of the body other than in the mouth. The whitefish were re-hooked in the mouth and then the fish were taped being brought in once again.

 

As part of the sentence, the court ordered them to destroy all video footage for November 6, 1995 that may be in their possession or control. Video footage already seized by the MNR was ordered forfeited.

 

Labignan's charge of failing to release a lake trout caught during a closed season resulted from an incident on the Trent River in Trenton on November 6, 1995. Labignan obtained a lake trout caught by another angler, hooked it onto his own fishing line, and recorded the fish being brought in.

 

In addition, Karen Monaghan, 37, host of a TV show produced by Canadian Sportfishing called the Natural Angler of Toronto, was fined $800 after she pleaded guilty to a charge under the Ontario Fishery Regulations of using a hook in a manner to hook whitefish in body parts other than in the mouth.

 

The court was told this offence also took place at the Trent River in Trenton on November 6, 1995, Monaghan hooked a number of whitefish in body parts other than the mouth using fishing jigs. The fish were then re-hooked in the mouth and recorded being brought in, hooked in the mouth. Monaghan was ordered to destroy all video footage for November 6, 1995 in her possession or control, and a forfeiture order was issued for the video footage already seized by MNR.

 

Waszczuk is scheduled to appear in Burlington court on April 6, 1998 to answer a charge of fishing in a fish sanctuary, and also in Peterborough court on April 16, 1998 to answer a charge of fishing for bass during a closed season. Both of these charges are under the Ontario Fishery Regulations.

[dude1125]

Part of the reason I never make it through a whole TV fishing program is they way they handle fish. The "classic" fish handling techinque is sliding the fingers underneath the gill plate to hold it up in the air...... ugh

[newflyer]

One of the beauties of fly fishing is that the hook can more often than not be removed without ever taking the fish out of the water - keep the pictures in your mind for those long winter nights....

 

(okay okay I am guilty of some hero shots - pretty hard to resist sometimes)

 

[Parry]

Always looking at the negatives. Ive seen many shows that show great handling of fish and proper techniques, why not point these shows out? why is it that everyone on this board must point fingers and look at negatives. For once id like to see, did you see so and so's picture or movie! what great release technique ect... *hit happens sometimes, im sure weve all dropped a fish on the rocks by accident at one point, or even dropped it in shallow water without a proper release... screw it, we should all just quit fishing all together, at the end of the day you are sticking a sharp object in the mouth, or in the throat of an animal, taking it out of its natural environment in order to save/attempt to save its life, and then releasing it back into the wild. As a result of this things will happen, and everyone will do it differently. Get over it

[Guest Sundancefisher]

 

Catch and release experts...fishing show hosts are not. That being said I saw Bill Dance do better than Italo. It seems that they have to pose way to long. When they grab the fish and turn to the camera and start talking...you know the fish is in for an extended stay out of water. Henry is bad at holding them and drops them in the boat often.

 

There was one other show the other day that was the absolute worst ever. That being said from a show perspective they want to encourage fishing and show the "beauty" of the fish. Hard to do when flashed for 1 second in the water. We need to respect some balance and if we don't like it...don't watch the show.

[BBBrownie]

Always looking at the negatives. Ive seen many shows that show great handling of fish and proper techniques, why not point these shows out? why is it that everyone on this board must point fingers and look at negatives. For once id like to see, did you see so and so's picture or movie! what great release technique ect... *hit happens sometimes, im sure weve all dropped a fish on the rocks by accident at one point, or even dropped it in shallow water without a proper release... screw it, we should all just quit fishing all together, at the end of the day you are sticking a sharp object in the mouth, or in the throat of an animal, taking it out of its natural environment in order to save/attempt to save its life, and then releasing it back into the wild. As a result of this things will happen, and everyone will do it differently. Get over it

 

Well, whether you like it or not, ethics and stewardship are important components of fly fishing heritage and are important to many of us. Because I am hooking a fish, I will always try and minimize unnecessary stress on the fish above and beyond the hooking. Why wouldn't this be important to you? I agree, negative comments are not effective communication, education is the means to change attitudes, but to me, no one is being bullied here, it is just an observation that it is in fact unethical to increase mortality by suffocating/mishandling fish. Why is there a need for some too hold fish away from the water for any period of time anyhow? Unless it is dinner, keep the damn thing near, or in the water.

 

And Sundance, I don't buy it. Fishin tv hosts should lead by example, not stupidity. You do not need an extended shot of a fish to see its beauty. You can get more than enough shot holding a fish over the water for 10- 15 seconds, then release, don't throw it, squeeze it, gill it. Craddle and release. Many new/aspiring fishermen get their first exposure to angling from these shows. Why can't they be held to a higher standard? If they focused more on technique, scenery/location, innovations in sport, their craft in general, then they wouldn't need these extend cock grip poses to glorify their jobs and fill precious boob tube minutes.

[Harps]

Sundance... there are underwater cameras.

 

 

Dustin,

There are many good examples on this board (and others) and they get pointed out. Of course, there isn't the conflict so less people view them (RileyS put it better than I would).

Like posted before, check out ThisisFly and Catchmag for great fish photos and article. SexyloopsTv on youtube has some quick fish handling, and keeps fish in the water, the New FF is great for fish handling.

 

Oh and fish handling aside... IL and HW were charged, not for fish handling but for poaching (fishing out of season, snagging, etc). Whether you handle fish rough or not, you'd better follow the law that is there to protect the fish.

[flyfishfairwx]

Always looking at the negatives. Ive seen many shows that show great handling of fish and proper techniques, why not point these shows out? why is it that everyone on this board must point fingers and look at negatives. For once id like to see, did you see so and so's picture or movie! what great release technique ect... *hit happens sometimes, im sure weve all dropped a fish on the rocks by accident at one point, or even dropped it in shallow water without a proper release... screw it, we should all just quit fishing all together, at the end of the day you are sticking a sharp object in the mouth, or in the throat of an animal, taking it out of its natural environment in order to save/attempt to save its life, and then releasing it back into the wild. As a result of this things will happen, and everyone will do it differently. Get over it

WHAT EVER

 

I am not going to PC this .

 

I think Dustin is feeling a lot guilty, and maybe very ashamed of his fish handling skills and needed to lash out!!!

 

Then again he maybe be a saint and wants to point out the good stuff he has done?

 

[reevesr1]

First off, I'm not directing this reply at anyone in particular.....

There is quite often a bit of hypocrisy when discussing picture taking, or more specifically not picture taking. As we mature as fishermen, quite often our frequency of picture taking slows as we start to feel we've taken enough. But we tend to forget that many newer fishermen still have a sense of accomplishment on each fish and may want a picture. It is up to us to try to help them handle the fish in the best way possible. I don't think it is however up to us to say "no picture for you" now that we have all the ones we think we need.

 

 

 

[maxwell]

i agree with you on this one rick! but in some cases like on this board some things need too be pointed out not only for the person who hasnt had much knowledge on fish handling but for all who also read the thread! its a shitty game in smoe ways because one person who didnt kno gets flamed as other lash out but it seems that the average fishing pic posted latley has bin better for the most part..ive bin grilled two back when i was first learning tha basics and major parts of fish handling and every year try too take it too another level.. i think what happens needs too happen and those who get the finger pointed out need too understand the upside of the post.. and as a mod help with taming down the flames!

[Garlicmarshmellow]

Sorry Sundance, can't agree with ya on this one. Standing there blabbing while holding a 12 inch bass that slowly is suffocating is not showing beauty. Chances are, on some of these fish, he did retakes, and the fish was out of the water longer. If I showed up to your lake and held one of beauty rainbows in the air while blabbing to a buddy or one of my kids, to show them the beauty of fishing, you'd come give me a piece of your mind and rightly so. Dustin, I'm not being negative here, I'm pointing out something that I saw that was completely unacceptable, in fact I thought it was quite disrespectful to the fish. If I was being negative, I would of bashed the show BY NAME and it's host and called him a a ton of names. If you still think I was being negative, I'll live on tomorrow. Myself, if I was doing a show, I'd take the fish off the hook, one quick lift to show the folks and release. 5 seconds max out of the water and then I could blab blab blab on what I did.

[flyfishfairwx]

Rick

 

Nobody said do not take pictures of fish, matter of fact that is all I take of the fish..

 

It is just that the pictures do not need to be done at the 4ft level above the water, or with the fish at an up or down angle, what is wrong with a fish resting in a net, or just on the water surface?

 

With burst photography on today's digi cameras you can get 20- 50 shots of the fish at water level while it is reviving and not stress it as much as some of the "pros" with their metered wait for the sun to come out time delayed grip and grin shot at chin level..

 

The Op's question was are bass tougher then trout when out of the water or while out of the water.. you are damn right they are, for all the reasons given, and if somebody wants 50 shots of them holding a fat fish at chin level while grinning, then fish for bass or even warm water pike.. but and there is always a but keep the hands out of the gills and at least wet your hands before grabbing it and put it back in the water while waiting for the light to get just right or the sun to get from behind a cloud bank.

 

Note to some - every thing after the word "pike" was meant as light hearted banter and bullshit teasing - so retract the claws !!!!

 

here it is G-P thingy

 

 

First off, I'm not directing this reply at anyone in particular.....

There is quite often a bit of hypocrisy when discussing picture taking, or more specifically not picture taking. As we mature as fishermen, quite often our frequency of picture taking slows as we start to feel we've taken enough. But we tend to forget that many newer fishermen still have a sense of accomplishment on each fish and may want a picture. It is up to us to try to help them handle the fish in the best way possible. I don't think it is however up to us to say "no picture for you" now that we have all the ones we think we need.

 

[bhurt]

Over the years I have taken alot of fish photo's, where some of them bad fish handling skills, you bet, but these photo's where taken when I didn't have much knoweldge and as I learned more things change to the point now that if I do not have someone with me to take the photo of the fish then there is no photo.

 

When taking a photo I now hold the fish so its belly is laying in the water, I do not know how many times in the past I would hold it up and the slimy thing would squirm and fall out of my hands, and that is not good at all, so no more.

 

As for the fishing shows I would have to say by what I have seen is that 90% of them are extremly bad, so bad that I refuse to watch any show on the tv. I remeber I was watching one show where the guy would just toss the small mouth bass over his shoulder back into the water. Another show I watched the guy torpedoed the fish back into the water saying YOU HAVE TO DO THIS SO THE FISH WILL NOT DIE. and then another one where he was holding the fish by the lips. Its this kind of things that causes alot of bad fish handling skills in my opion.

[WesG]

I cant understand why Italo even has a show, we as fisherman should not support someone that has blatantly broken the regulations and been charged for it, not once, but twice!!! I dont even understand how or why sponsers/advertisers would want to get there name and brand behind someone like that. He is by far the worst for holding fish out of the water for the glory shot as well, even while sitting there stressing how important it is to release then quickly. Ever time I see his crap on TV I get angry.

 

Rant over, discuss

[SilverDoctor]

The one that really makes me wince is the buys that hold fish by sticking a finger under the gill plates. Oh those delicate gills.