Picklejar Lakes- Catch And Release

[McLeod]

No more harvest..No more bait ? C and R. Let's see in 10 years if the fishes are bigger,..We can hope !

[Slanter]

Well, my opinion (backed up by nothing but pseudo-science) is that if anything this will contribute to smaller fish. I think those lakes are overpopulated, and competition for sparse resources is what stunts their growth. Take away one predator, and you only amplify that situation.

 

That said, the point of those lakes is not to produce big sport fish. So, I think C and R and no bait is probably good for the purpose they serve to Alberta's overall fish conservation strategy.

[jpinkster]

Echo Slanter's statement above. Those smaller high altitude lakes just don't have the food supply to yield large fish. You'll find plenty of long skinny ones, but pretty rare to stumble upon a football up there.

[troutlover]

Smaller High altitude lakes in Banff produce cutts over 5 lbs and 20 inches on a regular basis. All of them are catch and release however none of the ones im thinking about are stocked. One of the lakes im thinking of is one of the highest elevation lakes in a national park. That said there are also lakes within 3km of some of these "big fish" lakes that produce small fish on average. I think each lake is its own eco system and food supply will determine the size of fish not altitude. One lake in BNP has seen a sharp decline in population and size it was alarming to biologists and the did a study on the micro biological levels in the lake and found them crashing for a reason they did not know the biologist we talked to said high alpine lakes without a strong micro biological base can not sustain large fish. I am not a biologist I don't know what conditions need to exist for a strong micro biological base.

[albertatrout]

 

Smaller High altitude lakes in Banff produce cutts over 5 lbs and 20 inches on a regular basis. All of them are catch and release however none of the ones im thinking about are stocked. One of the lakes im thinking of is one of the highest elevation lakes in a national park. That said there are also lakes within 3km of some of these "big fish" lakes that produce small fish on average. I think each lake is its own eco system and food supply will determine the size of fish not altitude. One lake in BNP has seen a sharp decline in population and size it was alarming to biologists and the did a study on the micro biological levels in the lake and found them crashing for a reason they did not know the biologist we talked to said high alpine lakes without a strong micro biological base can not sustain large fish. I am not a biologist I don't know what conditions need to exist for a strong micro biological base.

[albertatrout]

A lake (regardless of location) can only produce a certain amount of biomass per year. Say a lake can produce 100 kg of fish per year and has 100 fish, each fish has the potential to gain 1 kg that year. Say suddenly fish numbers increase and you have 1000 individuals, each fish would only be able to average a gain of 0.1 kg over that year. Fish density is a very important factor in fish size potential, especially in mountain lakes where productivity can be limited (like 1 to 2 kg/ year/ hectare). Diversity on the bug scene is also important, if scuds are around production generally increases as they are relatively efficient at moving resources up the food chain. I have read about a case in a high lake in Jasper where a herd of goats or sheep fell through the ice. They could actually measure the increase in production the next year as the scud population shifted upwards (i have witnessed dead sheep coveted in scuds. Kind of cool). Other experiments showed adding a bag of fertilizer made big fish for a few years but the nutrients eventually run out and lakes return to near baseline. Alpine lakes are fairly simple as far as ecosystems go as more productive lakes have far more variables/species to try and understand. Catch and release can actually make fish much much smaller in some cases, stunting is common in alpine lakes as food/nutrients is generally limiting, not spawning or winter habitat like in many other systems.

[troutlover]

The lakes in BNF that I know with big fish 6 lakes all are not stocked and have self sustaining populations that spawn in the outlets would this have an impact on fish size?

[McLeod]

Smaller High altitude lakes in Banff produce cutts over 5 lbs and 20 inches on a regular basis. All of them are catch and release however none of the ones im thinking about are stocked. One of the lakes im thinking of is one of the highest elevation lakes in a national park. That said there are also lakes within 3km of some of these "big fish" lakes that produce small fish on average. I think each lake is its own eco system and food supply will determine the size of fish not altitude. One lake in BNP has seen a sharp decline in population and size it was alarming to biologists and the did a study on the micro biological levels in the lake and found them crashing for a reason they did not know the biologist we talked to said high alpine lakes without a strong micro biological base can not sustain large fish. I am not a biologist I don't know what conditions need to exist for a strong micro biological base.

 

I am curious as to the one lake. If its the one I think you are referring to I have my own therory.

[albertatrout]

The lakes in BNF that I know with big fish 6 lakes all are not stocked and have self sustaining populations that spawn in the outlets would this have an impact on fish size?

It depends how succesful the spawning is, if fish numbers get too high size will go down. I know of several lakes with outlet spawning, a few have crazy high fish numbers and relatively small fish (14" is a good one) while others grow nice size trout. You can also look at the average depth in some cases to get an idea how big the fish can get, shallower (more littoral area) generally means more food production. There are lots of factors at play but it all boils down to production.

[troutlover]

McLeod clear your message box and ill send you a PM

[jpinkster]

It depends how succesful the spawning is, if fish numbers get too high size will go down. I know of several lakes with outlet spawning, a few have crazy high fish numbers and relatively small fish (14" is a good one) while others grow nice size trout. You can also look at the average depth in some cases to get an idea how big the fish can get, shallower (more littoral area) generally means more food production. There are lots of factors at play but it all boils down to production.

 

Just so I'm understanding this clearly:

 

A shallower lake has the potential to hold larger fish? Never thought about that before.

[SilverDoctor]

Nutrients are certainly a big key. Many of those high lakes have no close vegetation along the shoreline that would also add to both the water nutrition and bug life/bug shelter. Interesting about wildlife adding to the nutri base, makes a lot of sense. There was a small Alpine lake in BC we fished that was fairly barren. Someone planted willow shoots along the shoreline, enough survived to make a real difference in the amount of bug life and Trout Growth. I had heard of another high lake that had a landslide that deposited a lot of mud and trees at one end. Trout and bug life bloomed in the next few years.

[jpinkster]

Diversity on the bug scene is also important, if scuds are around production generally increases as they are relatively efficient at moving resources up the food chain. I have read about a case in a high lake in Jasper where a herd of goats or sheep fell through the ice. They could actually measure the increase in production the next year as the scud population shifted upwards (i have witnessed dead sheep coveted in scuds. Kind of cool).

 

In unrelated news ERSD has now announced that they will be dumping all road kill into many of your favorite lakes and rivers across Alberta in an effort to entrench Alberta as a world renowned trophy fishing destination.

[albertatrout]

 

Just so I'm understanding this clearly:

 

A shallower lake has the potential to hold larger fish? Never thought about that before.

Yup, shallower generally will mean more sunlight getting to the substrate, more invertebrates, and therefore more food for the fish. This is also influenced by other factors like density of fish/ species of fish/ nutrient inputs but in general it holds true.

[trailhead]

By the way Picklejar aren't stocked, those are native fish. Might also have something to do with the C&R.