Round Table Discussions /fisheries

[Guest tallieho]

anybody no where,when & give anybody can attend? thanks

[bloom]

The one in the South (Lethbridge/Medicine Hat area) is usually in April. Terry Clayton usually sends the invites, but there's not a whole lot of people there. Not sure who runs the runs in the Central part of the Province.

[Guest tallieho]

was reading an article in a mag,they mentioned that there was a meeting in october. outdoor edge mag.

[DonAndersen]

tallieho,

 

Info on the Provincial Fisheries Roundtable is found here. http://www.srd.alberta.ca/fishwildlife/fis...roundtable.aspx

 

 

The Provincial body is composed of SRD staff & executives or representatives of fishing organizations throughout Alberta. The meetings are held in April & October usually. They have been held in both Red Deer and Edmonton. There is no admission and lunch is supplied.

I'm positive that the Provincial Roundtable would like someone from Calgary - anyone - just a single soul. So far, the Provincial Roundtable has been unsuccessful in soliciting people from Calgary.

 

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

 

[PGK]

.

[DonAndersen]

I've got it or @ least some of it.

 

To solicit some interest from Calgarians, I going to introduce the following resolutions @ the next Provincial Roundtable [more will be added as I think of them]

 

* no fishing within 500 yards of any access point on flowing waters in Alberta.

* raise the fishing license fees to FF types to $200/yr.

* limit the access to popular streams to those that were born here

* no guiding in Alberta - by anyone

* Mac Boats are required to have large holes drilled in the bottom near the water line. Only by rowing rapidly downstream will the holes stay above the water line.

* Bud beer will not longer be sold in Alberta - reduces my backpack weight hauling out the trash.

* digital cameras will not be allowed within 200 yards of flowing water - the time saved by the picture police can be used for help on the item above.

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

[birchy]

I've got it or @ least some of it.

 

To solicit some interest from Calgarians, I going to introduce the following resolutions @ the next Provincial Roundtable [more will be added as I think of them]

 

* no fishing within 500 yards of any access point on flowing waters in Alberta.

* raise the fishing license fees to FF types to $200/yr.

* limit the access to popular streams to those that were born here

* no guiding in Alberta - by anyone

* Mac Boats are required to have large holes drilled in the bottom near the water line. Only by rowing rapidly downstream will the holes stay above the water line.

* Bud beer will not longer be sold in Alberta - reduces my backpack weight hauling out the trash.

* digital cameras will not be allowed within 200 yards of flowing water - the time saved by the picture police can be used for help on the item above.

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

 

 

How about a resolution that forces Don Andersen to preface every statement he makes with "in my opinion", or finish it with "but that's just my opinion". I'm thinking it'd be standing room only.

 

...

 

But that's just my opinion.

[DonAndersen]

Birchy,

 

in my Opinion, you're on - every comment made @ the next Provincial Roundtable will be prefaced as you suggest - In My Opinion.

 

In my Opinion, there will be some buses for the Calgarians. It will be a pleasure to meet all of you/any of you/ or in keeping with tradition - none of you.

 

In my Opinion, what I clearly don't understand is why Calgarians don't make the effort to attend and focus on the things that matter to them, get resolution and effect change.

 

And that make two of you - Loyal... wanted free beer, you want In My Opinion.

 

 

In my Opinion, both are crap,

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

[Guest tallieho]

thanks for the info.Don.It would seem that i've missed the meeting on october 18 in edmonton.Any highlights to this meeting that you might share would be greatly appreciated.thank-you

[birchy]

Birchy,

 

in my Opinion, you're on - every comment made @ the next Provincial Roundtable will be prefaced as you suggest - In My Opinion.

 

In my Opinion, there will be some buses for the Calgarians. It will be a pleasure to meet all of you/any of you/ or in keeping with tradition - none of you.

 

In my Opinion, what I clearly don't understand is why Calgarians don't make the effort to attend and focus on the things that matter to them, get resolution and effect change.

 

And that make two of you - Loyal... wanted free beer, you want In My Opinion.

 

 

In my Opinion, both are crap,

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

 

Making other people feel wrong, or stupid, for their choices is not going to effect the change you desire. Off-handed comments (insults) regarding Calgarians not showing up for these meetings, is not going to encourage them to show up all of a sudden.

 

Instead, maybe you should appeal to a person's emotions regarding fly fishing and the waters they love. Maybe give some examples of concerns that have been raised at previous meetings, and the subsequent changes that have taken place because of those concerns. Maybe people will think "hey, maybe I CAN make a difference!"

If you want others to try building cane rods, instead of saying (in not so many words) "unless you build rods from scratch, you are not a rod builder, you are a rod assembler", you might say "you know, I started off building rods the way you to, and it was very enjoyable. The natural progression for me was to try building from scratch, and I've had great personal fulfillment doing that. I think you would too if you gave it a try." or something along those lines.

And you know what? If a person listens, then great! If not, it doesn't mean they're a bad person, or somehow inferior because that's their choice. Maybe you don't either, but it sure sounds that way when you talk down to people, and call their opinions "crap".

 

I can't speak for everyone, but personally, I'm far too busy with other things in my life that are more important to ME. When it comes down to it, I'd rather spend time with my wife and 1 year old son than drive to Edmonton for a fisheries meeting.

 

I'm sure you're a good man, with good intentions. And I definitely respect your years of experience and knowledge. I also know that it's easy to misunderstand a person's 'tone' by reading something that is typed. But I do have a problem with people stating their OPINIONS as FACT. The last time I checked, the gospels were Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John... not Matthew, Mark, Luke, and Don.

 

 

 

 

P.S. - sorry for the thread hijack tallieho.. i'm done now.

[H2O]

To generate interest in Calgarians why not try having a meeting in Calgary? Or would that be too simple? I'm sure you'd have a huge turnout. Maybe the Fisheries universe doesn't extend into this side of the province? Maybe a good analogy would be if you want a cheerful rally for republicans you don't invite any democrats?

 

I doubt I would make the 3 hour drive to Edmonton, a big city I've never been just to share an opinion when there are much cheaper options like online forums and email. The gas alone would be expensive, maybe that's why they don't make the drive from head offices in Edmonton, due to the amount of funding F & W recieves in Alberta they probably can't afford the gas.

 

In my opinion.

[maxwell]

lmao don ur freakin hilarious..

 

 

but seriously now how about posting before the meeting making peiople infromed that there is a meeting coming up and that more people need too attend.. i would love too bomb up or down too get in on these meeting but i usually hear about them from someone like yourself after they are done... is tehre a mailing list? or would be like too post em on the board? maybe a month or something before they are happening..... IN MY OPINION i think it would help calgarians and otehr people plan a trip too wereever too get on these meeting.....

[headscan]

To generate interest in Calgarians why not try having a meeting in Calgary? Or would that be too simple? I'm sure you'd have a huge turnout. Maybe the Fisheries universe doesn't extend into this side of the province? Maybe a good analogy would be if you want a cheerful rally for republicans you don't invite any democrats?

Have to agree. Why Edmonton and Red Deer but not Calgary? I'm not a member of the "Calgary is the center of the universe" camp, but why leave out the largest population center in the province? Sure Edmonton is the provincial capital, but I doubt that Vancouver gets left out of similar roundtables in B.C. To me it would make the most sense to have these in Edmonton, Calgary, and Lethbridge. If they can't get Calgarians to show up and really value their opinions/input then maybe they need to bring a meeting to Calgary.

[rusty]

Calgary is also home to the most heavily fished water in the province (even more than Pigeon).

 

Lots of guys from here drove to BH for that fisheries meeting, so I'm sure that you'd get good turnout especially if in Red Deer.

 

Honestly though, why Red Deer and not Calgary or even Lethbridge? Calgary's got nearly 12 times the population and is way closer to the Bow, Oldman, Liv, Crow, Newell, Crawling, McGregor, Travers, etc, etc. Not saying there isn't some excellent fishing around Red Deer, but if you want involvement come closer to the people.

[Weedy1]

Not saying there isn't some excellent fishing around Red Deer, but if you want involvement come closer to the people.

 

Sorry Russ, but that's exactly what they are doing. They are having the meetings where the people who are interested in attending are primarily located. (cough, cough, Edmonton)

 

The interest in the meetings is obviously from stakeholders who primarily come from Red Deer north. This can be seen by looking at the lists of attendees in the meeting minutes listed under Notes from Past Meetings for the roundtable discussions in the link I have provided.

 

http://www.srd.alberta.ca/fishwildlife/fis...roundtable.aspx

 

By the way there is excellent fishing all around this province. The world isn't flat and it sure as hell doesn't end at the Bow.

[PGK]

.

[DonAndersen]

Maxwell et al,

 

Not trying to be hilarious - see this post and the response - it's sad

 

See: http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=6632

 

But the question remains - how to involve Calgarians. Some recent suggestions include:

 

* have the meeting in Calgary

* notification well in advance

* a suggestion made @ the Roundtable was rent a bus

 

What must be considered is the cost of all the meetings. SRD sponsors the meeting - most of their people are from Edmonton. It does drive the cost of the meeting up to have them elsewhere.

 

 

regards,

 

Don

 

[H2O]

Not trying to be hilarious - see this post and the response - it's sad

 

See: http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=6632

 

Should try and read all sections, missed that one, that is sad! How embarrassing.

 

 

 

 

 

[maxwell]

well jsut keep me posted on th one in the spring don and i will be ther eno problem.. if anyone is interested my durango can fit 5-7 (if i take out all the fishing gear) wich is no problem.......

[Guest Sundancefisher]

Maxwell et al,

 

Not trying to be hilarious - see this post and the response - it's sad

 

See: http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=6632

 

But the question remains - how to involve Calgarians. Some recent suggestions include:

 

* have the meeting in Calgary

* notification well in advance

* a suggestion made @ the Roundtable was rent a bus

 

What must be considered is the cost of all the meetings. SRD sponsors the meeting - most of their people are from Edmonton. It does drive the cost of the meeting up to have them elsewhere.

 

 

regards,

 

Don

 

 

When SRD fails to have a meeting in Calgary or even south of Red Deer for that matter, I am surprised they would ask why Calgary fishermen fail to show up for the meetings.

 

Logistics seem to clearly point that when doing a round table on an issue to take it on a road show. The fact it costs some extra money to have some staff come to Calgary shows the utter lack of value the Conservative Government places on fisheries management in this province.

 

People are busy with kids, work, holidays, birthdays, etc. and taking a full day to chat with the Roundtable after reading this would make me not want to go even if I had SEEN any advertising on it. If the Roundtable fails to go to a huge population center like Calgary then that tells me it is absolutely not very serious. I call it lip service.

 

If you can only host two... Edmonton and Calgary would make sense. If you wanted some serious involvement from the public you would have them in Lethbridge, Calgary, Red Deer, Edmonton, Fort McMurray, Peace River and Grand Center (for a quick example of locations).

 

If you just want to "say" you consulted the public, and do nothing anyways...what they are doing seems to work great. :-(

 

At the very least they should have a detailed agenda in advance, an email address and/or website in which to submit responses, questions, concerns, cudos or whatever such that the roundtable can address them and provide a detailed response after the discussion. There are lots of live feed technology out there with the opportunity to provide feedback via email could work.

 

I have never known the province (politicians versus front line employees) to really give a rats ass on the "issues" that concern fishermen. Now that the government has revoked signed agreements with oil companies, crushed the economy after the royalty screw up, we are only a few months away from another cut on the fish and wildlife budget. Just watch and see what Stelmach can ruin next.

 

Not a pessimist...just a realist on this issue. I would go if I felt it was not a waste of time... If I feel it is a waste of time I would just leave as life is too short. That makes Calgary way more convenient for me.

 

Just a side note... If cost is an issue for government officials etc. to come to Calgary...how about some thinking outside the box. A silent online auction to raise funds, looking for sponsors...Outdoor World would surely contribute if Wholesale and Fishing Hole do not, maybe they can bunk at someones house for a few nights...eat at a pot luck or weiner roast... THINK PEOPLE...THINK...

 

Anything can be done if PEOPLE REALLY WANT IT TO HAPPEN...

 

Sigh

 

Sun

[rehsifylf]

I've got it or @ least some of it.

 

To solicit some interest from Calgarians, I going to introduce the following resolutions @ the next Provincial Roundtable [more will be added as I think of them]

 

* no fishing within 500 yards of any access point on flowing waters in Alberta.

* raise the fishing license fees to FF types to $200/yr.

* limit the access to popular streams to those that were born here

* no guiding in Alberta - by anyone

* Mac Boats are required to have large holes drilled in the bottom near the water line. Only by rowing rapidly downstream will the holes stay above the water line.

* Bud beer will not longer be sold in Alberta - reduces my backpack weight hauling out the trash.

* digital cameras will not be allowed within 200 yards of flowing water - the time saved by the picture police can be used for help on the item above.

 

catch ya'

 

 

Don

 

LOL

 

[rehsifylf]

Maxwell et al,

 

Not trying to be hilarious - see this post and the response - it's sad

 

See: http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=6632

 

But the question remains - how to involve Calgarians. Some recent suggestions include:

 

* have the meeting in Calgary

* notification well in advance

* a suggestion made @ the Roundtable was rent a bus

 

What must be considered is the cost of all the meetings. SRD sponsors the meeting - most of their people are from Edmonton. It does drive the cost of the meeting up to have them elsewhere.

 

 

regards,

 

Don

 

I missed the post Don. Any reason this was posted in the Not Fishing related topic. As I recall that was when the Three Words Only nonsense was ongoing, so it would have been easy to miss.

 

I have to say, that move the meeting should alternate between Calgary and Edmonton. If they have one in Calgary, and make people aware in advance, and they still get no/low turnout, then statements could be made about how disinterested Calgary is. Notifying the fly shops, the fly fishing clubs, and on here and I suspect the turnout would be quite high.

[DaveJensen]

I'm afraid that our friend Mr Andersen has again drifted the Chernobyl across a pool, and it appears to be the wrong pool. Clearly the right bait to get a rise, mind you.

 

To clarify, the provincial level FRT was originally intended to be a bit of a higher level meeting with attendees from various lobby groups with a few members at large who were specifically, personally invited for input on specific issues. I have not attended these, though have been asked to attend I have not because I am more interested in the regional level meetings - on one and trying to get another going.

 

The Regional level meetings, of which there is currently only one region doing this (more in a second), are far more open door minded. The Red Deer Region FRT meetings cover quite an area and a broad spectrum of fisheries - warm and cold. The concept drafted by bio Vance Buchwold is to host an annual meeting that addresses fisheries issues in our region, and holds presentations of fisheries work as well as discussions of the work and items of inportance to attendees. The regional meeting puts forth suggestions to changes for that region, to which the provincial level FRT is supposed to look at in its meetings and either adopt, throw out, or park. Because there is only one region doing this at present, it's difficult to follow procedure.

 

Now, I have talked to Dave Christiansen and Steve Herman about getting a SES FRT mtg going for our ES trout fisheries and Dave maintains that this is likely forthcoming. The same format and concept will likely apply. What I would suggest is that the folks from the Calgary area contact their local bio for their region and say, the guys in the Red Deer Region have theirs, the SES region is likely to get their regional level meetings, can we set something like this up for the Calgary region? If this could happen, then we would get a better procedural system of having the open door regional meetings across the province where Joe and Jonny and the Jill's of the world can be involved in the F Mgt process, while the provincial level - that is repped by the lobby and interest groups, as well as political reps and bio reps all have their say - as those are the three bodies that impact regulations change in this province.

 

Frankly, the information sharing and ideas that come out of these kinds of meetings are very good. The bee in my bonnet right now is getting the RDR F Mgt Plan back into gear, to reopen it and to implement whatever changes come from the process of public, political, and biological input. The whitefish #s are way down, walleye way up, browns hit and miss, and pike sporadic. I have a commitment from Vance to look at this and start process come Dec - Jan, so hopefully this will occur. This is the kind of thing that happens on the Regional level, and I'd encourage folks to try to get their bios to open the door to their own regional meeting. A F Mgt plan on given watersheds are important, a useful tool that could incorporate input from streamwatch, tu, etc. An Oldman River F Mgt Plan likely exists, and this regional level FRT discussions would be exactly where input would be garnered, and regular folks like us can get involved.

 

So, give your local bios (biologist, btw) and see what you can get started. It's all really interesting stuff.