Acupuncture

[tbone]

I was just wondering what your experiences are with acupuncture? Ive never been before but am seriously considering it. I've been going to the chiropractor for the last 8 months with mixed results. I slipped a disc in my lower back last spetember which has since healed with regular chiropractor visits and physio. Since February I've started waking up every morning with back spasms (in the mid back area just next to my rib cage on both sides). The Chiropractor does not seem to make a difference with this issue...and waking up in pain at 4am every morning sucks. Any advice? Thanks.

[Guest RedWiggler]

Accupuncture hurts like hell man, I always assumed it was painless until I needed it. I had it done twice and was like "no more man, get those needles away from me". Mind you mine was in my foot and knee were there is not alot of meat but still it sucked and was painfull. My .20

[beedhead]

I broke my neck playing Hockey when I was 14, since then my neck has been pretty screwed at times, the chiropractor thing worked for years, then about 2 years ago he tried to get it back in shape and couldn't, So it was the chiropractor that sent to accupuncture, and it's worked-so far...I still have bad days, but not like I used too...Give it a try...It's somewhat uncomfortable, but....

 

Cheers...Jeff..

[Bobr]

I had a back injury years ago that sounds similar. I somehow managed to compress 2 discs and ended up 1/2in shorter...

I had a fairly constant cramp in my back and reaching around the base of my ribs towards the center for about a year or so. Much like the one you get when your calf cramps up in the middle of the night.

 

I tried chiro and got limited relief, as a matter of fact at one point I was in there 2 or 3 times a day @ no charge because the Doc was as frustrated with it as I was. It helped a bit but nothing permanent.

I never did try acupuncture for that injury but did for others and found it wasn’t all that helpful. (But I may not have been as patient as I should have been.)

 

Anyway I went to these guys and they fixed me up in a couple weeks. Mostly with exercise.

 

Canadian Back Institute

103-240 Midland Pl Se

Calgary AB, T2X 1N2

 

Phone: 403-256-8060

Fax: 403-254-2707

 

website: www.cbi.ca

email: calgarysouth@cbi.ca

 

It is/was a private clinic at the time and it wasn't cheap if remember right, but it fixed the problem. To me that was all that mattered.

I wasn’t fond of the thought of spending the rest of my days in pain.

 

Hope this helps

[Castuserraticus]

My wife has recurring back spasms. The best remedy she found was Dr. Brian Abelson - he's a chiro by training but does pretty well 100% active release now.

 

We've both used acupuncture through Saatcha Health Centre and like it - Jag Johal.

 

Have you tried therapeutic massage? I've gone to a guy at 5th Ave. Physio for various sports injuries. Most massage therapists burn out in less than 5 years due to repetitive strain injuries but Dave has lasted over 12 years because he's 6'4" and real strong. He can usually get everything moving after 3 treatments. He's shown me many pains are referred - the injury site and the pain location are not the same - so it takes a broader approach to actually get relief. It hurts like hell initially but it sure works.

[kipper]

My wife has recurring back spasms. The best remedy she found was Dr. Brian Abelson - he's a chiro by training but does pretty well 100% active release now.

 

We've both used acupuncture through Saatcha Health Centre and like it - Jag Johal.

 

Have you tried therapeutic massage? I've gone to a guy at 5th Ave. Physio for various sports injuries. Most massage therapists burn out in less than 5 years due to repetitive strain injuries but Dave has lasted over 12 years because he's 6'4" and real strong. He can usually get everything moving after 3 treatments. He's shown me many pains are referred - the injury site and the pain location are not the same - so it takes a broader approach to actually get relief. It hurts like hell initially but it sure works.

I would try physio first and then some massage therapy. Physio first as you need to strenghen muscles and ligaments that hold the spine together. I just went through six months of this stuff due to slipping and landing on my as* while flyfishing last fall at Bullshead wasn't too funny at the time though. Physio really helped and i have been using a message therapist to keep things moving. Message therapy is also great if you have a sciatic nerve problem on the side complicated by discombobulation of the spine..from the neck down .

[tbone]

Thanks for the advice I appreciate it. I have a deep tissue massage scheduled this week and I hope it helps. I may try acupuncture too as a last resort. I've been lifting weights for years and stopped immediately after my injury...Ive resumed 6 months later and have been building strength again but my flexibility (especially rotating from the trunk) isn't the same as before. I bought a fitness ball to do stretches and some light back exercise and I hope that helps too.

 

My chiropractor does do active release but it doesnt seem to be helping much. The pain I get is only in the morning and clears throughout the day as I become more active.

[bigdaddy]

Chiro typically treats the symptoms, not the cause. An adjustment puts things back in place but doesn't do much to address why things are out. A combination of physio/chiro/massage and acupuncture work together to treat the cause and symptoms. Acupuncture is great IF you find someone that you feel works for you. Same goes with all the others.

 

I've found a massage therapist in NW Calgary that knows her stuff. She'll tell you what she finds and gives her recommendations on treatment (refers you to others if she feels she's not a good option for your problems) and she outlines her treatment plan for you.

 

Pro-Active Health

241-6068

 

Talk to Kim

[Guest Sundancefisher]

I was just wondering what your experiences are with acupuncture? Ive never been before but am seriously considering it. I've been going to the chiropractor for the last 8 months with mixed results. I slipped a disc in my lower back last spetember which has since healed with regular chiropractor visits and physio. Since February I've started waking up every morning with back spasms (in the mid back area just next to my rib cage on both sides). The Chiropractor does not seem to make a difference with this issue...and waking up in pain at 4am every morning sucks. Any advice? Thanks.

 

I tried accupuncture for Bell's Palsy a while back. The red headed, caucasian gossiping chatter box did not give me the warm fuzzies that she had any clue what she was doing. She even had the gall to say in between gossiping breaks with the receptionist that she needed to go back in and stick a few more pins in the patient.

 

While I am a sceptic I do believe accupuncture can relax some people and can even stimulate nerve endings. More often I would think a placebo effect would occur.

 

That being said I would be way less sceptic if the treatment came from a 55 year old naturalized chinese fella or gal that had trained for 20 years in China on ancient chinese medical arts.

 

Now I must say my opinion of chiropractors are that they are a total joke profession that have no redeeming value other than swindling people out of hard earned money. Did the chiro diagnos this or did someone else? If just a chiro you should get a non chiro second opinion. If it is a slipped disk a chiro could be making it worse and not better. Consult a physiotherapist on your alternative and one not associated with a chiro.

 

I know many people that see chiros and they love them...in fact so much the chiro has them booked in for "regular" maintenance treatments. WHAT A FREAKING JOKE. If they did any good you would not need to see them again. Massage therapists are awesome. They fix people so that they do not need to go back. Chiros snap joint and inflame nerve endings so much that yet the overstimulation dulls or kill the pain...until the inflamation subsides and then it comes right back. Often back pain is attributed to something completely different such as a foot problem and snapping vertebrae does not fix it.

 

My advice to you from some who has had bad back pain is to:

 

1. drink plenty of water

2. exercise using approved doctors exercise techniques

3. have massage therapy to limber up old strained muscles.

4. look to remove some stresses in your life and fish more

5. watch your posture while on the computer or watching tv etc.

6. check your mattress and maybe replace it out.

 

Good luck with the pain and hope you get well.

 

Sun

[fishinhogdaddy]

Boy! A little bitter regarding Chiropractors huh?

[tbone]

Thanks for the advice, appreciate it.

 

I went to the massage therapist and have some really painful trigger points in my lower back. Realized most of my problem was my posture in front of the computer which is what I am on for 8 - 10 hours per day. In the 3 days that Ive changed my desk/monitor/chair arrangements I've actually felt a lot better waking up in the morning. I got a new desk 6 months ago with a keyboard tray that was too low and tried to make it work for me but I think it ended up %^$@*ing up my back as it put strain on my muscles all day long and then after sleeping for several hours, my back was stiff as a board. No more keyboard tray, the keyboard will remain on top of the desk for now...

 

Thanks again...I feel too young to have chronic back pain and was getting pretty frustrated.

[Guest Sundancefisher]

Boy! A little bitter regarding Chiropractors huh?

 

Yup :-)

 

Sadly I know a lot of people that have lived with recurring pain while seeing a chiropractor. I feel for people that get robbed and are too trusting of what they think is a legitamate health care professional.

 

My advice is always seek a second opinion when the problem is significant or the problem persists. Think of medical people like mechanics. They all have an opinion on how to fix the problem but chances are one is right the others are either out to lunch or close but not close enough.

 

How many times has a doctor said...hmmm...not sure what it is...let's try this treatment and "see" what happens.

 

A chiropractor just thinks to himself/herself. How long can I get this guy/gal coming to see me before they realize I have done absolutely nothing but take their money and time.

 

Sun

[bigdaddy]

. In the 3 days that Ive changed my desk/monitor/chair arrangements I've actually felt a lot better waking up in the morning. I got a new desk 6 months ago with a keyboard tray that was too low and tried to make it work for me but I think it ended up %^$@*ing up my back as it put strain on my muscles all day long and then after sleeping for several hours, my back was stiff as a board. No more keyboard tray, the keyboard will remain on top of the desk for now...

 

Get an ergonomics assessment of your work space. Many larger employers offer this through HR or their wellness program. A properly set up work space should feel good.

[acurrie]

Let me just say, that as a Chiropractor I can understand some people may have had some negative experiences with certain Doctors. I'll will be the first to admit that there are some slime ball docs out there who get you going 4x/week for years without anything to show for it. But I will also say this is the exception, not the norm. It takes minimum of 8 years to be a licensed D.C. in Alberta, 4 years for the degree and 4 years of Graduate/ clinic work.... so unlike some of have mentioned, we are a very legitimate health care profession and go through extensive board exams to get a practice permit. We cannot fix everyone, but nor can any other healthcare profession. I believe that many types of alternative health care can be beneficial includng acupuncture, massage, physio, meditation.. etc etc, but again, it is not for everyone. Everyone is entitled to there opinion, and that just my two cents.

[Weedy1]

Letterman's "Top 10 Signs You've Gone to a Bad Chiropractor"

 

10. When you walk, you make a wacky accordion sound.

 

9. Keeps saying, "A spine is like a box of chocolates."

 

8. Repeatedly asks, "You a cop? You sure you aint' no cop?"

 

7. Over and over, you hear crunching sounds followed by, "Uh-oh."

 

6. There's a two-drink minimum.

 

5. At end of session, lies down on the table and says, "My turn!"

 

4. He was nowhere near Woodstock and yet he's covered with mud.

 

3. Rushes in late to your appointment still wearing his Burger King uniform.

 

2. Hints that for an extra $50, he'll "straighten" something else.

 

1. You're fully clothed and he's naked.

 

 

Sorry Drew, I couldn't resist.

[Jimmy]

Drew; Thanks for having the balls to make a post!! I have had on going lower back problems all of my life and been to many chiro's and the benefits have only ever been short term at best.. I finally gave up on chiros after the last go around 3 years ago. A young whipper snapper who thought he knew it all..He buggered me up so bad during 3 sessions that I ad to take 10 days off work to recuperate.. I am now fully jaded and think chiro is BUNK...Too bad about the 8 years of school!!

[acurrie]

Sorry to hear that Jimmy, I guess it beats having the surgeon make a mistake though!

[PAV]

I used acupuncture for my knee a couple of years ago for some pain that wouldn't go away after 1 month of

rest. After my first acupuncture session the pain was gone. I went about 4-5 times and then finished the

hockey season pain free till the last game which was about 4 months after the treatment. I play goal so my

knees take a pounding and I was pretty surprised it worked. I would do it again for sure.

[alan2]

Well, as someone who has had lower back problems since 1991, I can say I've tried everything listed here and many more not listed. My chiropracter still helps as much or more than Canadian Back Institute (a joke) craniosacral therapy, rolfing, active release, therapeutic massage, accupuncture and and the orthopedic surgeon. (waited 9 mos to be told it couldn't be fixed by surgery---thankfully!)

 

One procedure that helped me over time was prolotherapy---most folks have never heard of it, and it was hard to find anyone who could perform it. Used a lot by pro atheletes---which I certainly am not! I used to drive to Red deer mostly, a doctor there did it. It is saline injections into supporting ligaments (lower back for me) that have stretched due to injury; it causes local tissue irritation which stimulates additional ligament cell growth. Strengthening exercises will do absolutely nothing for ligaments; the best you can hope for is to strengthen muscles in the same area. Prolotherapy actually causes new tissue growth over time. I used to go every 4-6 weeks, get about 8 spots injected in lower back under local anesthetic, and over time, my sacroiliac was much better, more stable, less likely to misalign from certain twisting, bending movements.

 

Now the odd time that I do need a Chiro visit, it stays aligned much better. And doing lots of core stability exercises also has helped.

 

There are always people who think chiros are quacks, but there are useless people in many professions. Look at the wrong cancer diagnoses by the hundreds in those clinics in the Maritimes. So using Sundance's logic, everybody in that profession just must want you to die.

[wtforward]

Tbone

 

Backs...what do you do and what works for some doesn't work for others.

I have had a lower back issue for sometime. Years of playing squash took it's

toll. You have had the diagonsis right ?...a scan or Mri. If not that is a possible

starter. A book I have is entitled 'The Back Doctor' by Hamilton Hall. Well worth

picking up if you would like to know more about types of back pain. The fix is

as everyone has suggested is what ever works for you. I have tried accupuncture

and it really helped to quiet down the back spasms. Once I got that under control

I started a series or morning exercises everday ( lifestyle change) to maintain

core muscles in the lower back. An equally important thing for me is to maintain

a flexible stretching component as well. I took a yoga class for that and that has really

helped to maintain flexibility in the hip flexors...which if very tight can contribute

to significant lower back pain..especially if recovering from an injury. Just as a side note

I sat on a ball at work for a year for stability exercise but gave up when I rolled the

ball with me on it across and errant staple and it exploded. Luckily no back injury.

If you want a yoga instructor who deals with back injury exercises send me a pm.

It is about managing your particular situation and attitude is everything.

[birchy]

I'd recommend BodyTalk. I was a skeptic at first but I've seen the results first hand and it's pretty amazing.

 

http://www.bodytalksystem.com/bodytalk/

 

If you look in some of the testimonials, i'm sure you'll find some about chronic back pain.

[flyangler]

Tbone

 

Naturally, I would recommend acupuncture after a doctor has ruled out anything dangerous. But then, I'm an acupuncturist. With red hair. Who's not Asian. And doesn't practice anywhere near Calgary.

 

I've been a massage therapist for 20 years and people probably see me for back pain more than anything. I have a very good record with a combination of acu and Chinese medical massage known as Tuina. But one treatment usually will not make a significant difference in chronic pain. The changes you are making in your work station sound like you're doing your homework and are committed to self care and that is a good part of the battle. Don't give up on acupuncture if you aren't all better in one try or the chemistry with the practitioner is off. Try somebody else.

 

In the US, medical doctors and chiropractors can do acupuncture if they have a 150 hour seminar. Licensed acupuncturists here have, on average, 3 years of training at a master's degree level requiring two years of college first. But attend to the chemistry thing. As a previous poster pointed out, if your practitioner seems less than professional, all of that book learning and those hundreds of hours in clinic mean a whole lot less.

 

Let us know how it works out. This seems to be a community that cares.