ReelLife Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Where do you guys draw the line between using a switch rod versus moving to a proper 2-handed rod in your fishing? I am thinking of maybe using a switch rod for my chironomid fishing from a boat (use up to 3 flies up to 5 feet apart on a 20' leader and an indicator). I thought this set-up might be easier to cast than with my 9' 5 wt or 6 wt single-handed rod. A switch rod at 10' 6" is also not too long for handling in a small boat. Note the line I am currently using is a floating WF 5wt or 6 wt. The fish being caught are in the 15"-22" range (the odd one could be bigger). So what size switch if appropriate? Further to this, how about a switch rod for pike fishing in a lake (boating or wading)? What size would one need that would be equivalent to an 8 or 9wt single-handed rod and what line for throwing big streamers? Maybe in this application I should be just looking at the regular two-handed rod? I am a newbie to the whole spey casting scene and so am doing the Loop spey casting clinic in May. I just got myself two books: Spey Casting by Simon Gawesworth and Two-Handed Fly Casting by Al Buhr. Neither book talks specifically about switch rods. I wish I could see Courtney when he comes to Calgary and talk to Gordon when he comes, but will be in England. Currently, I do not own any two-handed rods. I was hoping to get into spey casting for both river and lake fishing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headscan Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 I think a switch rod would be fine for what you want to do. Honestly I think you could even get away with using your 9 foot rod and just using single-handed spey casts with it. On the weekend I was using a 9' 4wt Loop Opti rod with an Opti Stream line to cast 3 nymphs under an indicator using single hand speys, although my leader wasn't 20' long. I believe the Loop Opti and Multi lines are designed as shooting/spey lines with a colour change between the head and running line so you can see where the load point is with ease. Before buying a new rod/reel/line you might want to talk to the guys at Whistler about the Loop lines or Courtney might be able to suggest a Snowbee single hand line that would do the trick. The Beulah switch rods are quite nice as well, though. I doubt you'd have any trouble nymphing or chucking big streamers with one or fishing for pike. I think the main difference you're looking at between a switch and a spey is the distance you can cast with it. The switch rods are also nice for high stick nymphing and overhead cast decently. The Gawesworth book is good, but you might also want to check out the Rio Modern Spey video. After watching the video I realized that I wasn't getting the full picture from the book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeler Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 If you're going to be doing alot of overhead casting, the switch is a better choice than the spey, I find my Beulah 7/8 is much easier to cast in that regard, and I've had it out tossing big bull trout streamers both overhead and spey casting with no problems so far. For lighter duties, talk to the guy selling the 4/5: http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=3659 Beulah recommends either a 6 or 7 weight line with it, depending on the taper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwell Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 do u wana get your feet wet or take the plunge.. i take ou tmy switch from time too time when i wana do more single handed stuff and throw lighter rigs and whatnot and just mess around more with the overhand casting too.......... i would recommend a lightweight spey in teh 11-13 foot range 6 or 7wt........... sage loop scierra snowbee and g loomis all have a rod or two in that category Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReelLife Posted March 25, 2008 Author Share Posted March 25, 2008 If you're going to be doing alot of overhead casting, the switch is a better choice than the spey, I find my Beulah 7/8 is much easier to cast in that regard, and I've had it out tossing big bull trout streamers both overhead and spey casting with no problems so far. For lighter duties, talk to the guy selling the 4/5: [url=http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=3659]http://flyfishcalgary.com/board/index.php?showtopic=3659[/ur Are you using the same line for overhead casting and spey casting or changing between two different lines as shown below? Switch rod 7/8wt line suggestions: Single hand/ Overhead casting 240-270 grains Traditional line tapers: ~S.A. GPX 9wt ~Rio Grand 9wt Specialty line Tapers: ~Rio Outbound 8wt ~Teeny longshot 8,9wt ~SA steelhead taper 10wt ~Beulah River extra 10,11wt Spey casting-370-390 grains over 29-31 ft. ~Beulah Elixir 380 (Designed Specifically for our Switch 7/8) ~Rio windcutter 7/8/9 omit tip 2, Skagit 350 Cross-over casting ~Airflo 40plus 8wt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speyghillie Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Hi ReelLife, It really is 6 to 1 and half a dozen, the little switch rod should be fine, a word of wisdom................................................................... don't go to England, come to God's country, SCOTLAND. Gordon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeler Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 I have both the Elixir line for the spey casting and a Snowbee 9 wt line for overhead casting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headscan Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 The Elixir can be used for overhead casting as well, but it won't necessarily give you a delicate presentation. The only non-spey casting I really do with mine is flipping it over while high sticking nymphs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
126barnes Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 This spey lingo is way too confusing, way to many options in lines. Watched Rio's modern spey video the other day with Simon G, While I enjoyed the parts with him. These West coast guys with their snap t or z with a half perry poke on river right with down stream wind standing on one leg while scratching there arse was a bit confusing to a single handed who fishes the other side of the river when the wind is blowing the wrong way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
126barnes Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 That said I would love to be able to do it.......................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDone Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bigbadbrent Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 all this mentioning of 7/8 weights for non-gerard-trout sigh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogilvie Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 all this mentioning of 7/8 weights for non-gerard-trout sigh Many years ago when some of you fly fishers thought your thing was for peeing! Sage and a few others made 11' 2 pc, 5 and 6wt rods that are actually heavier than the modern day Beulah Switch rod. Some,myself included, used these as small Two Handers casting very small bugger type flies off the beaches for Sea Run Cutthroat Trout,Pink,Coho and Chum Salmon. These rods were actually designed for lake fishing when Chan and a few others, picked up the torch and really studied what Jack Shaw already knew and expertly expanded on it. The ability to pick up 50' to 60' off the waters film and make a single cast to the same distance is trying for most small rods. Although I must admit that lake fishing isn't only about distance or Chironomid fishing! My favorite has always been the dry fly or slightly sub surface emergers and leeches. Alberta does have some major lakes with some very nice fish , I agree with Brent that the 7/8 Switch isn't really necessary but if thats what you have utilize it's efficiencies and have some fun ( I use Val's 5/6) C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headscan Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 all this mentioning of 7/8 weights for non-gerard-trout sigh Further to this, how about a switch rod for pike fishing in a lake (boating or wading)? Still non-gerard-trout but probably requires more rod than a 4/5 weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDone Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogilvie Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Theres a fellow from Duncan who was fishing Pinks in Campbell River with the 4/5 Switch . That is One very fast River and he was sort of a novice,and yes broke the rod...trying to pull a Salmon onto the rocks...not a good idea... Headscan is bang on...the 4/5 is a trouter C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReelLife Posted March 26, 2008 Author Share Posted March 26, 2008 Still non-gerard-trout but probably requires more rod than a 4/5 weight. Yes I am thinking the 5/6 for most of my lake fishing and the 6/7 for the 40"+ Pike . Need Weedy1 to post a picture he took of a pike caught by Doc (Mike Monteith) at Wabamun Lake a couple of weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bigbadbrent Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Oh wait, next time I'll use my 3 wt, thats so much more sporting 25" plus bows in this lake will put a permanent kink in anything under a 5wt, as well the prevailing valley winds turn the lake into a whitecap topped tempest. as Courtney knows I tried the 4/5 the year before but felt out gunned. Its not always about he size of the fish. Its amazing the type of responses coming from this board, you try to help out and there always seems to be a certain few that believe they know more than anyone else. So why not use a 5 or even a 6weight, if they don't put a permanent kink in it? I never said a 3 weight, or even a 4..hell, i never even specified the rod weight. The board is full of opinions, my opinion is that the essence of 'sporting' in fly fishing is in the fight. As Jim Mclennan put it in his newest book, 'its not the rod that lands the fish quick, its the way its fought by the angler'...i can land fish just as quick on my 4 weight as my 5, and i think its a lot more fun... People use 7-9 weights for permit, 6 weights for bonefish and they do just fine...seems to me you're not fighting permit or bonefish in the specified lake. Reellife, i think you're set if you get a 5/6 as a trouter, and a 6/7 for your pike rod, maybe one size bigger cause pike flies are right massive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedy1 Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 People use 7-9 weights for permit, 6 weights for bonefish and they do just fine...seems to me you're not fighting permit or bonefish in the specified lake. Nope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bigbadbrent Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 that was directed to Colin, not you pike are big and ugly, you need a big and ugly rod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedy1 Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 that was directed to Colin, not you "Forum" definition - a public meeting or assembly for open discussion. (In other words I will poach, hijack, reply within, respond, counter,and or answer any thread I feel like and you can't do anything about it.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alhuger Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Are you using the same line for overhead casting and spey casting or changing between two different lines as shown below? Switch rod 7/8wt line suggestions: Hey Reel, I have done some fishing on lakes with spey rods and I can offer you this, match your line type to the fishing. Remember that many of the lines in question do lend themselves to being stripped much past the head. Often when I am fishing I will strip all the way back to the boat especially when fishing bait fish patterns, damsels etc. I am gravitating towards using a skaggit and a sinking line. The skaggit I can strip in further and it is (for me) likely easier to throw indie rigs for chronies (although I have not done yet, I used a scandi last time). The sinking line should speak for itself. So far I am not sold on the benefits of using a spey for lake fishing from a boat. From shore though.... -al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alhuger Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 So why not use a 5 or even a 6weight, if they don't put a permanent kink in it? I never said a 3 weight, or even a 4..hell, i never even specified the rod weight. The board is full of opinions, my opinion is that the essence of 'sporting' in fly fishing is in the fight. As Jim Mclennan put it in his newest book, 'its not the rod that lands the fish quick, its the way its fought by the angler'...i can land fish just as quick on my 4 weight as my 5, and i think its a lot more fun... People use 7-9 weights for permit, 6 weights for bonefish and they do just fine...seems to me you're not fighting permit or bonefish in the specified lake. Reellife, i think you're set if you get a 5/6 as a trouter, and a 6/7 for your pike rod, maybe one size bigger cause pike flies are right massive Do you ever tire of baiting people on the board? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bigbadbrent Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 "Forum" definition - a public meeting or assembly for open discussion. (In other words I will poach, hijack, reply within, respond, counter,and or answer any thread I feel like and you can't do anything about it.) lol! btw, that is one hell of a pike i hope it fried up real nice, specially from Wabamun, the toxins just tenderize em! Al, my mind wanders a lot, and it seems it likes to trespass..i'd hardly call my thoughts being baiting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwell Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 not too take back my opinion but.....if u want too do some pike/heave streamer fishin and fishing nymphs streamer dry on teh bow i would say a spey forsure and something in teh 7-8wt range around 12 feet.......... i have bin using a 12' 6" 8wt for bullies and whatnot tossing a chopped skagit with any tip and some mega streamers if i wish and for the bow im tossing a 11'6" 8wt for streamers on teh bow with a chopped skagit system... both work great for underhand and overhand casting... havnt fished frmo a boat yet but frmo shore on lakes "surfcasting" is deadly..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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