adc Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 The Oldman River Chapter of TU will be working to have a Streamwatch student CO in the Upper Oldman/Livingstone area starting in May......For those of you not familiar with Streamwatch it places a Student Conservation Officer in a designated area who is repsonsible only for monitoring, educating and enforcing angling and stream violtaions such as misuse of quads, violations by industry and other environemental infractions.........Student CO's have all the powers of a policeman except the power to arrest.........They report directly to and are supervised by the local F&W CO but have responsiblities ONLY for doing the stream work---i.e aren't called out on bear patrol, etc. etc...........The program was started on the Ram and Blackstone rivers by the Central Alberta TU chapter (Barry Mitchell/Don Anderson) and has been very successful..........It has also been expanded to the Edson, Sundre and GrandCache regions........Many of the fines levied under the program have been channelled back into funding the Streamwatch program....... To put a Student CO in the field from May through September csots approximately $25,000.......This pays for wages, accomodation, vehicles, fuel, sat phone, etc......Funding is raised through corporate donations and individual donations as well as fundraising projects such as raffles, auctions and dinners, and TU National helps with some funds as well as administers the program and provides tax receipts to donors........ A number of folks on this Board have already pledged to help with donations.......If you are interested, you can send cheques to me---Allan Caldwell, 137 Coachwood Point, Lethbridge, T1K 6A6------and cheques should be made payable to Trout Unlimited and clearly marked "Southern Alberta Streamwatch".....I will hold any individual cheques "in trust" and in the event the program doesn't raise sufficient funding to put a Student CO on stream in May, your cheque will be returned....... The success of the program ongoing is through coporate funding.........If you work for, or know of, companies who have an interest in improving the quality of the angling experience in the Oldman/Livingstone drainage, please send me a contact and I will be glad to discuss the Streamwatch program with them and how they can help...... Long term, we would like to see the program expanded in S. Alberta to also include the Carbondale/Castle drainage but we believe the prioity should be the Upper Oldman/Livingstone first..........Anything you can do to help will be appreciated...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisher26 Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Great! The people who have taken the time, effort and money to put this all together have my deepest thanks, for their effort and work. Stream watch speaks volumes for the angler commitment and dedication of passionate sportsmen to preserve our natural resources. I really hope this program continues into other regions also desperate for enforcement. Great job! :D :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonAndersen Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 ADC, Don Andersen can't take any credit for Streamwatch. Other than BSing about the issue and putting some $'s into it, it was Barry's thing and a good thing to!! catch ya' Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adc Posted January 24, 2008 Author Share Posted January 24, 2008 ADC, Don Andersen can't take any credit for Streamwatch. Other than BSing about the issue and putting some $'s into it, it was Barry's thing and a good thing to!! catch ya' Don Funny Don, when I fished with Barry in the fall he gave you some of the credit!!...........I guess he's just a nice guy!! ......At any rate, you guys in Central have done a great job of getting it up and running.........Makes our job easier now there's a blueprint........ Hey, MikefromSundre put a post on the "saving the Livingstone" thread and maybe you have some thoughts.......He's wondering if Streamwatch will ENCORAGE the gov't to pony up more resources for enforcement or DISCOURAGE them from doing so if it seems the anglers are getting it done.........Whatcha think??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnF Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Finally. Finally. Finally. This is some real welcome news Al. How about hitting up some of the O&G co's that have pipes and wellheads all across that FTR? I'm happy to support this initiative however I can. It's more than time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adc Posted January 24, 2008 Author Share Posted January 24, 2008 Finally. Finally. Finally. This is some real welcome news Al. How about hitting up some of the O&G co's that have pipes and wellheads all across that FTR? I'm happy to support this initiative however I can. It's more than time. Thanks Lynn.........We're hoping that the O&G's will be the ones to take on primary support for this initiative as they have a big stake in keeping people happy with what they're doing in the area..........Got any contacts you can pass on??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adc Posted January 25, 2008 Author Share Posted January 25, 2008 For those who may be wondering about the Streamwatch concept, here's a note from Don Anderson which I think is bang on........ Guys, For those with a short life span in Alberta, When I was a kid every forest officer, truck driver or grader operator working for Forestry could and would issue you a ticket for breaking most any kind of law. Things have changed. I've heard that we are now down to about 60 or so F&W Enforcement types most of which reside in cities and concern themselves with lost dicky birds, exotic wildlife and the like. So what to do - well the East Slope Angling Regulations helped some. That added some protection but the other 90% of the equation was enforcement or education. OK - Now what? the Fish and Gamers taught us a lesson. They've been asking for more enforcement for 30 years and the trend has gone down. So if the Gov't won't do it directly, perhaps a private/public partnership would work. Get the money and hope the Govt kicks in. Well Streamwatch in Central Alberta did just that. The Streamwatch folks fund about 50% of with the Govt kicking in some $'s + inkind contributions trucks etc. Of course, there were concerns that the Streamwatch person would become a glorified secretary or get caught up in dicky birds or playing with tourists. To this point, such fears have been unfounded. Ceertainly there have been occasions where Streamwatch folks were used for other than OHV and fishing infractions but by in large, they have kept their noses pointed firmly in the direction of what is important to our fisherries. As far as Govt doing it alone. Forget it. Taint important!! Thirty years of F&Gers' pounding their heads against a wall taught us that. Now if we could just get F&Ger's to recognize their plan hasn't worked and help Streamwatch along, things would/could be a tad better. I know in meetings with Govt that they are reluctant to give up the reins on anything where they have responsibility but on the other hand don't have the resources to do the job and further rarely want the private sector to do the work for them. A Catch 22 if I ever saw one. catch ya' Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnF Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Hey Al - I'm not connected high up in the O&G business by any means, but lemme use a phone a friend and see what I can come up with. And, of course, Mike and I are happy to contribute financially as well. Our cheque will be in the mail tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adc Posted January 27, 2008 Author Share Posted January 27, 2008 Just sending this to get it back near the top of the Board before it disappears!! :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 complete hijack here (sorry al) but it's been bugging the hell out of me recently...why can't the gov't keep some of the greenhorn CO's fresh out of the college down south rather than shipping them up north into bumsville or out east into the middle of nowhere...seems pointless to even go into the program and study fishery enforcement if all the gov't wants you for is for hunting enforcement...one of the reasons i've still yet to get my CO degree cuz i would rather help enforce my home turf so to speak rather than elsewhere...i'm so behind the streamwatch thing as a result of this...count me in al... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisher26 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Good point DBT, we should help (or attempt to help) enforce our home waters first. I mean to a certain extent the best streams are basically from Calgary southwards. No sense policing those streams way up North that barely have fish in them when we have the popular streams that go unprotected... Very good thread, Streamwatch is a great program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Good point DBT, we should help (or attempt to help) enforce our home waters first. I mean to a certain extent the best streams are basically from Calgary southwards. No sense policing those streams way up North that barely have fish in them when we have the popular streams that go unprotected... Very good thread, Streamwatch is a great program. it's not the streams up north that get policing either, it's the poachers in regards to hunting...fisheries take a backseat to hunting enforcement... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMasson Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 What streams, rivers and lakes north of Calgary don't have fish in them? Just wondering cause I fish central and northern Alberta quite a bit and have not found a lack of fish in either zone. I think the point here is that we need more enforcement and that extra enforcement needs to be spread out equally through all zones. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 What streams, rivers and lakes north of Calgary don't have fish in them? Just wondering cause I fish central and northern Alberta quite a bit and have not found a lack of fish in either zone. I think the point here is that we need more enforcement and that extra enforcement needs to be spread out equally through all zones. James to clarify my point...CO's fresh out of the college are being shipped north and east to enforce hunting laws...this is why i support the streamwatch program being that there is an understaffing of CO's in the south... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedy1 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 DBT - is the under staffing of CO's in the south any worse then the rest of the Province? In other words is the province as a whole short staffed or do you feel the south in particular is get shafted? Through discussions with the CO's out of Smokey Lake and St Paul it sounds as though they spend a good chunk of time on walleye poaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 weedy...you don't want my opinion on this...especially during winter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedy1 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 weedy...you don't want my opinion on this...especially during winter... Actually I would like your opinion, that's why I asked. I wasn't trying to be argumentative if my question may have come across that way, just curious as I have not heard a whole lot on this issue of balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 my numbers could be slightly off (one of the biologists can probably give you the exact numbers), but i do believe there are approx. 250 CO's in AB spread out across 61 districts and only 6 officers are located in the Pass to control the entire Oldman drainage up to the Prairie Parklands...these figures are hearsay and no matter how much i Google it, i can't find exact numbers...but aside from provincial parks (where i have been checked on average once a year), i have been checked 3 times in 20 years...i have phoned in ten times that number to the RAP...something's gotta be done...enter Streamwatch... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teck71 Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 What streams, rivers and lakes north of Calgary don't have fish in them? Just wondering cause I fish central and northern Alberta quite a bit and have not found a lack of fish in either zone. I think the point here is that we need more enforcement and that extra enforcement needs to be spread out equally through all zones. James James. you must be thinking somewhere else. Honest guys ain't nothing bigger than a fry north of Calgary, Right James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonAndersen Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 CO's - you have to be careful here. During Ralphies gut and chop @ Govt a number of CO's ended up in other depts. The CO's in parks for example. OK - here goes the numbers as best as I can recall - Sundre maybe up to 2 now - were @ one for some time. Rocky usually had 2 - lost them both, had none for a while and I think there is one now, Nordegg had 2 & then it dropped to one where I think it's still @. So there you've got it. Lots of troopers in the field!!! Dr. Char - be careful with the 250 numbers. That may be the whole dept including janitorial & labs. And Fisher26 - Streamwatch in Central Alberta raise the money for the enforcement of Central Alberta. Now if the Calgary guys see the SW of Calgary as important - maybe - just maybe they'll raise the money. catch ya' Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMasson Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 James. you must be thinking somewhere else. Honest guys ain't nothing bigger than a fry north of Calgary, Right James. I mean....there's only minnows up here...nothing worth spending time to catch. Teck, you're in Red Deer, right? Let's hook up sometime this summer and fish the Ram(s). I don't know if you've ever been into the canyon on the S. Ram but I think you would like it. Beautiful scenery and some nice cutties, whites and even bulls to go along with it. Getting down is easy enough, getting out is a bit strenuous. James PS. Sorry for the complete hijack! I think the streamwatch program is a great one. I plan on donating to both S. Alberta and C. Alberta. There definitely needs to be more enforcement, spread throughout the entire province! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tako Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Keeping in mind the difference between enforcement bodies... CO's typically only enforce laws in parks. Fish and Wildlife Officers enforce general fishing and hunting laws. But are usually too busy dealing with problem bears to enforce the laws Soooo do us all a favour, and shoot your limit of black bears this spring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Keeping in mind the difference between enforcement bodies... CO's typically only enforce laws in parks. Fish and Wildlife Officers enforce general fishing and hunting laws. But are usually too busy dealing with problem bears to enforce the laws Soooo do us all a favour, and shoot your limit of black bears this spring i just use the CO as a general term... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tako Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 i just use the CO as a general term... Aye, but once you get into budgets and enforcement and who gets what and goes where, a lot of supposed 'lack of enforcement' can be sorted out by looking at who's in each jurisdiction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulltrout Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Aye, but once you get into budgets and enforcement and who gets what and goes where, a lot of supposed 'lack of enforcement' can be sorted out by looking at who's in each jurisdiction. so being that you are in the biz, how many F&W officers are in place for the entire Oldman drainage (includes Upper OM, Lower OM, Castle, and Crow systems as well, to a different extent, the Waterton, Belly and St. Mary's systems) up to the Prairie Parkland Boundary of the Eastern Slopes?...that's my main point i've been trying to get across, not arguing semantics... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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