Frustrations In Tying

[ladystrange]

i need to rant for a moment.

 

do you ever have those days where you wished you had at least 2 more hands and in this case using your teeth just won't work because you are too crosseyed to actually see what you are doing?

 

i'm having one of those days. i'm doing a 2 part fly. 1 but 2 bodies... THE PROJECT. as i sit here cursing myself for actually attempting this. i find i am quite mad, crazy even. this seems to be a little too complex. expecially when there is no pattern, no picture and no directions. just the image i have had in my brain for the last few nights.

 

the floss in the bobbin thing worked well. somewhat smooth but since i was doing a weave it really didnt matter if i pawed at it a little.

 

i'm beginning to think an investment in the self retracting bobbin would be a REALLY good idea. however, for this project i had 3 bobbins going, tinsle and 2 wire ribs ALL at the same time. i'm feeling a little busy but i'm not sure how i could have simplified this monstrosity.

 

SIGH, back to my fly... body # 2, not on a hook. wire moves. i wish i had pondered this concept before i started...

 

anybody have a hand i could borrow?

[albannachxcuileag]

I know exactly what you mean! I was trying to make a true emerger, and still am! This was the prototype and it took half an hour to get it as scabby as this!

 

[SanJuanWorm]

Welcome to the world of Tying. Its the way it goes. Nothing comes easy.

[Flytyer]

Are you doing an extended body by chance? Sounds like one to me.

[ladystrange]

i can't say that i know exactly what an extended body is... i dont know the terms yet. just see something and tie it. most of the time it works.

 

anyway. this is what i was doing last night. nice to know at least one other person gets frustrated and they cant sort out what they are making either. lol - thanks AL

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i'm not sure if i am happy with it or not. i sort of think it looks like a 7year old's art project for school. i dunno

[Flytyer]

I'd tie that bead body directly to the hook and eliminate what you wound on the hook already.

[Inconnu]

Looks good LadyS. There are tools that can help with that third hand thing. I cannot remember what it is called but will look around. Perhaps someone else can help with the tool I am thinking of?

Here, I found something similar to what I was thinking of, though not exactly:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Double-Third-Hand-J...emZ170146445627

[ladystrange]

I'd tie that bead body directly to the hook and eliminate what you wound on the hook already.

 

 

that's the thing. i now that would have been easier, but wasnt the look i was going for. this isnt for fishing, but for presentation. or at least that was the intention in the first place.

 

if i were planning on using it for fishing, i would ahve definately done the beaded body. but dragonfly butts stick up.

 

the question i do have is about wings prependicular across the body.

 

kind of like the butterfly in flyanglers avatar - how do you make them stay like that?

 

what is the technique for wings that go out to the side rather than tying the stalk of the feather parallel with the hook?

 

that was my biggest issue.i was grumbling about the floss, but actually it was the wire that was in my way.

 

i like that 3rd hand contraption.

 

but i'm still a little leary about ordering online. tried it for the first time almost 3 weeks ago and have not rec'd my stuff yet and i have had no reply to my email either.

 

i will give it another week, send an email and then i will dispute the charge on my credit card. unfortunately this supplier is well known overseas and i'm not overly happy. perhaps i'm just impatient.

[Harps]

Try tying it on a short shank hook, and only have the extended body sticking it out back. You wouldn't have to worry about it affecting hook-ups if its a demo/art fly.

 

It looks good otherwise... and I think the x wings just comes with practice and a steady hand. (Try some looser wraps to position the wings than a couple of tight ones over the loose, not on bare stem, when you have them where you want them.)

 

Cheers,

Harps

 

that's the thing. i now that would have been easier, but wasnt the look i was going for. this isnt for fishing, but for presentation. or at least that was the intention in the first place.

 

if i were planning on using it for fishing, i would ahve definately done the beaded body. but dragonfly butts stick up.

 

the question i do have is about wings prependicular across the body.

 

kind of like the butterfly in flyanglers avatar - how do you make them stay like that?

 

what is the technique for wings that go out to the side rather than tying the stalk of the feather parallel with the hook?

 

that was my biggest issue.i was grumbling about the floss, but actually it was the wire that was in my way.

 

i like that 3rd hand contraption.

 

but i'm still a little leary about ordering online. tried it for the first time almost 3 weeks ago and have not rec'd my stuff yet and i have had no reply to my email either.

 

i will give it another week, send an email and then i will dispute the charge on my credit card. unfortunately this supplier is well known overseas and i'm not overly happy. perhaps i'm just impatient.

[mwalters]

Try tying it on a short shank hook, and only have the extended body sticking it out back. You wouldn't have to worry about it affecting hook-ups if its a demo/art fly.

 

It looks good otherwise... and I think the x wings just comes with practice and a steady hand. (Try some looser wraps to position the wings than a couple of tight ones over the loose, not on bare stem, when you have them where you want them.)

 

Cheers,

Harps

 

 

I've got a hand you can borrow, but I'm not a tyer yet

 

I looked at that double 3rd hand tool. I bought one years ago at Radio Shack that I use for soldering. You could check with somewhere like Active Electronics to see what they have.

[ladystrange]

we still have to go fishing mike.

 

maybe next year i will get you into tying. come over to the dark side. lol

 

but yeah, i could use the extra hand. so you could either drive out here to calgary and maybe do my breaks and an oil change while you're at it and i'll tie you some flies

 

or i could just go down to the electonics shop and pick up another hand. they probably have something like that at house of tools or princess auto

[albannachxcuileag]

Ladystrange said this on the 18th October-

i can't say that i know exactly what an extended body is... i dont know the terms yet. just see something and tie it. most of the time it works.

 

I think you might have had a look at this article that I had written for our UK forum already but explains various extended body methods that can be used when dealing with standard hooks.

 

Extended Body methods

 

There is a method that I have not included in the SBS but one that I am going to put up on our site and in here once I have ironed out all the bugs! LOL!

It will give perfect segmented body shapes for any type of aquatic nymph or terrestrial that will allow the tyer to get colouration as close as possible to the original.

 

Watch this space!

[dryfly]

No comments about technique ... the damsel looks good for presentation. One hugely picky point is tht damsel wings lay flat on the back as opposed to dragon wings that are perpendicular AT REST...damsel wings obviously are perpedicular when flying.

[flyangler]

That is one beautiful fly! I love those blue/greens.

 

It really does seem that frustration is just another word for invention. Getting wings to lay flat is at least a three part effort: swearing, drinking, and flattening the feather stems with a pliers. Flattening a few beverage cans with your forehead is also an option. Ill advised, but satisfying.

 

Oh, yeah, a dab of superglue to hold things where you want them before wrapping any more thread. Use this very sparingly, so that it doesn't wick into any pretty parts of the fly. Then, as in the case of the big blue butterfly, if things don't lay down the way you want them, you can cover the butts with more feathers and/or chenille. That's why the macaw butts have peacock body feathers at the base. I meant to do that.

[lonefisher]

Best bet is to just swear a bit a throw your bobbin at your vise go for a smoke and try again when you get back..... if you can find your bobbin..... if not just head for the closest liquor store. Works everytime..... well maybe I don't quite remember I still can't find most of those bobbins. BUT my beer bottle collection is HUGE

 

But in all seriousness I think that fly came out pretty neat. If thats the first prototype then I think you are well on your way to a kickass fly.

[Inconnu]

Ms Strange, ordering online should not be a problem if you check out who you are ordering from and pay via PayPal. One other thing and I only mention it because it is the one place myself and others who shop online do not do anymore is to order from China or HongKong.I mean no disrespect in general it is just that those are the only places we have had any kind of problem ordering from. Just another thought, I have seen the unit I sent you a link for in local craft stores here in Edmonton and I have seen single jawed units in the Dollar stores that may work well enough to help you decide if you could use the more expensive model.

[ladystrange]

thanks for the advice again to all.

 

great article AL and sbs

 

Flyangler - i like to flatten beer cans against my forehead. it works wonders.

 

but seriously, i will assume now that you tied the butterfly... how did you get the jungle cock on the end of the macaw feathers. that was something else i was going to do with the dragonfly next go around. but i am using cul du canard for the wings as it is more transparent. just superglue on the back of the jungle cock and position on the bottom feather.

 

i just roosted through my other, other box of feathers and discovered a pheasant collar and saddle i cleaned and dried last year, nice burgundies and teal/greens. i'm thinking of doing the short shank hook, minimal floss on the body, burgundy wire legs, the blue eyes and burgundy/teal beads and dubbing on stiffer wire. and then using the more rounded pheasant feathers for the wings, with some jungle cock.

[flyangler]

You can tie the JC nails onto a longer feather by stripping the stem of the jc, laying it in next to the big feather's center vein and tying them both in at once, then layering another feather over the top. I did that with the red butterfly I tied, but on the lower wings which are shorter. http://tinypic.com/4d7bdxe.jpg

 

Big Blue's eyespots are glued onto the big macaw feathers because I didn't have any nails with stems that long. You could also sew them onto a big feather stem by bringing the needle up from under the big feather next to the vein, catching the JC nail stem and back down through the big feather again.

 

Does all this resemble tying? When you invent a fly, you get to invent THE WAY it's done. You also get to invent your own headache cures. The pheasant feather tie you've got planned sounds wonderful, I can't wait to see it. Good tying and good luck to you!

[flyangler]

oops i posted that twice

[ladystrange]

oh wow,

 

i like the red butterfly.

 

oh think i need A LOT more practice before i post anymore creations. need more beer and to throw a few bobbins around.

 

i need to go to a hobby shop and pick up some super glue and a third hand. oi.

[Flytyer]

You can make your own little helpers with just a few blocks of wood some lenghts of 1/8" rod and alligator clips with some tubing slipped over the jaws. With these materials you can make most any kind of holder or "hand" you want; even a gallows tool for tying parachutes.

[ladystrange]

oh i am so full of stupid questions...

 

what's a gallows tool

[Flytyer]

A gallow's tool:

[ladystrange]

ahhh, right. gallow - the place once used to hang people.

 

thanks. i guess i could have guessed that it was an apperatus used for hanging things. told you it was a stupid question

[rhuseby]

The only stupid questions are the ones you don't ask. It's fascinating to see how patient some tiers are in making the sort of patterns I see on here. Me, if it takes over 10 minutes per fly, I'm raging. Do you crush the beers cans on your head full or empty?