jpinkster Posted September 14, 2015 Posted September 14, 2015 This from the Oldman Chapter of Trout Unlimited Canada: Gold Creek's threatened Cutthroat Trout sadly received another blow to their recovery in Mid-July when a substantial amount of coal and other substances released from a historic coal spoils pile on the east flank of Grassy Mountain. The material moved down slope into Gold Creek via a small tributary following a major rain event and was recorded as far away as the Crowsnest River, some 12 km downstream. Early observations suggest a massive blow to Cutthroat Trout populations as a result of this release. Riversdale Resources, an Australian mining company operating as Benga Mining, purchased the abandoned Grassy Mountain open-pit coal mine in August of 2013 with an eye to redeveloping the site to produce metallurgic coal for the Asian market. Exploratory work is now underway while the full approvals process takes place. A two year environmental impact assessment of the project has been ordered by the federal environment minister, but in light of recent events, a good case for stronger protection and oversight during the exploratory phase of the project could easily be made. Gold Creek, on the east flank of the project, is listed as critical habitat for Westslope Cutthroat Trout (WSCT) above the waterfall which has kept this population genetically pure by restricting the upstream movement of non-native Rainbow Trout. Cutthroat Trout now persist in only about five percent of their historic range so every stream where they hang on is increasingly, and critically, important. On the west flank of the mountain lies Blairmore Creek, a portion of which is also listed as critical for the recovery of WSCT. To the north lies Daisy Creek, spawning grounds for our provincial fish, Bull Trout, also listed as threatened in Alberta and under consideration for an elevation of their federal status to "Threatened" in this watershed. Earlier this week, someone asked a question on this page wondering if our efforts in Hidden Creek are in vain given reports of new coal developments in the area. Well, I guess that's up to all of us now. I encourage everyone to ask questions, share this post, consider the trade-offs being asked for, talk about it with each other, contact your elected officials and others and let them know what you expect and what your vision of the Oldman Watershed looks like. Let us know what you think by leaving a comment on the post. Knowledge is key; the more we share, the more we know. Action can serve to raise the quality of the mitigation solutions for all involved and insure best practice is followed. Please act. I've heard some early reports that the impact on the fishery could be substantial. The entire country blew up over the death of 30 herons at the Nexxen pipeline spill site, I'm curious what the fallout might be for this? Quote
albertatrout Posted September 14, 2015 Posted September 14, 2015 Any data supporting these "early reports". Also, why is it an issue now? Those tailing have been present as an issue for decades and would have been much worse during the actual mining period. Also, would the new mining project not re-dig that area meaning it will be reclaimed following modern methods/ standards? Fighting that development seems like a nimby issue rather than a protect the cutts issue. I would think a mine operating then re-vegetating those slopes would be a good thing.I wish someone would do the same at Tent Mountain, it looks like 10x the sediment issue from what I've seen. 5 Quote
WinstonConfluentus Posted September 15, 2015 Posted September 15, 2015 Here we go again albertatrout. The information presented in the post is mine, that's Kevin Turner not Winston who handles the simple stuff, and I believe it will easily stand the rigor of review by professionals in the field. I lack the resources to test for selenium or it would be done not only in Gold Creek, but throughout the watershed.Information available on Riversdale Resources website clearly indicates there is a problem with selenium among other things and you would be well served by knowing what you are talking about before starting with the tired old "nay say".The shocking and saddening thing to me is yours was the only comment on this environmental disaster given the nature of the forum. I have put a tremendous amount of effort into protecting this fishery; if I were king for a day, the privilege of fishing this watershed would be handed out in direct proportion to the effort put forth towards its welfare.Shame on you and anyone else who calls good, honest effort down and stands by while our fishery is destroyed. End of rant. 4 Quote
albertatrout Posted September 15, 2015 Posted September 15, 2015 Here we go again albertatrout. The information presented in the post is mine, that's Kevin Turner not Winston who handles the simple stuff, and I believe it will easily stand the rigor of review by professionals in the field. I lack the resources to test for selenium or it would be done not only in Gold Creek, but throughout the watershed. Information available on Riversdale Resources website clearly indicates there is a problem with selenium among other things and you would be well served by knowing what you are talking about before starting with the tired old "nay say". The shocking and saddening thing to me is yours was the only comment on this environmental disaster given the nature of the forum. I have put a tremendous amount of effort into protecting this fishery; if I were king for a day, the privilege of fishing this watershed would be handed out in direct proportion to the effort put forth towards its welfare. Shame on you and anyone else who calls good, honest effort down and stands by while our fishery is destroyed. End of rant. Shame on me and anyone else who questions ya eh? There was no doubt in my mind who wrote it. Sorry that questioning your antics/statements is “shocking and saddening” but that’s how the scientific mind works. I have spent a fair bit of time on conservation initiatives myself (mostly on the ground, not so much over social media) and know a fair bit about sediment issues, invasive species , as well as selenium issues in the area as well as across the west slopes. I’d hazard a guess the road runoff which comes off the trunk road, or even the Atlas road every time it rains impacts more fish habitat than that slope. Also, if the cutts have persisted thus far the selenium must not be all that crazy. Remember the guideline is extremely conservative and an occasional exceedance occurs in untouched rivers and streams as well (there are some natural exposed slopes in the mountains too). Hard to make a statement of effect on one or two samples. I was wondering if fish sampling had occurred or what the cause for sudden alarm was, what I get now is very little has changed in 50+ years. It’s an abandoned un-reclaimed coal mine, you seem very opposed to the new project being discussed. The new project would have to adhere to modern mining rules/ reclamation requirements which should reduce impacts on the creek. Seems to me this project could provide a huge benefit in regards to the historic sediment issues you seem to have identified. It is amazing to me the cutts persevered through the initial mining of the area (never mind most of the streams in the area, ever saw a photo of the Crowsnest River 70-80 years ago) and they should be protected, but a single slope with some exposed rock is not an issue of national significance. I think this project seems like a gem versus something like that Ram River Coal mine up by Nordegg. I appreciate the effort you put in, but I have had to distant myself from a certain TU chapter due to these sort of approaches/ antics. Not the way I think conservation should be approached in every case but good luck to you. 2 Quote
WinstonConfluentus Posted September 15, 2015 Posted September 15, 2015 Albertatrout I certainly don't have to explain myself to you but in the interest of the fishery I'll bring you up to speed on a couple of points. You really should come out and see for yourself before throwing around the "facts" the way you do. If your not shocked and saddened by this you don't belong in conservation work. I've worked on the land without comment or compensation for over twenty five years hence the Winston thing to maintain the anonymity I once cherished. It is the depth of my work that finds me forced into the mainstream, not any desire for recognition or having to deal with the likes of this.The Oldman TU chapter is undergoing a revitalization with many new, young members and active, boots-on-the-ground participation. Check out the Facebook page and website for more info. Our project links are on the FB page, sign up! Antics indeed. Caldron Creek has always provided a refugium in the Gold Creek system and it is this that is likely responsible for their persistence. I've been working with forestry, not an easy proposition prior to the election, for years regarding the Atlas Road. The first sediment barriers went up this year with much more, including bridge replacement to follow. I've never said I am against the mine. In fact, I have engaged Riversdale many times directly with the tact that if we are going mining, we are not going poisoning too. Tech provides an excellent example on how to work towards doing this right. That said, they will be in court on October 29, 2015 in Fernie to face charges regarding a very similar event. So now where were we, oh ya, shame on you. You sound like a quadder defending the damage they do by pointing the finger at others or another fellow most of us have come to love. Scandal? Oh look, a terrorist!I should have listened harder to G. B Shaw before I allowed this to raise my blood pressure. Quote
albertatrout Posted September 15, 2015 Posted September 15, 2015 Albertatrout I certainly don't have to explain myself to you but in the interest of the fishery I'll bring you up to speed on a couple of points. You really should come out and see for yourself before throwing around the "facts" the way you do. If your not shocked and saddened by this you don't belong in conservation work. I've worked on the land without comment or compensation for over twenty five years hence the Winston thing to maintain the anonymity I once cherished. It is the depth of my work that finds me forced into the mainstream, not any desire for recognition or having to deal with the likes of this. The Oldman TU chapter is undergoing a revitalization with many new, young members and active, boots-on-the-ground participation. Check out the Facebook page and website for more info. Our project links are on the FB page, sign up! Antics indeed. Caldron Creek has always provided a refugium in the Gold Creek system and it is this that is likely responsible for their persistence. I've been working with forestry, not an easy proposition prior to the election, for years regarding the Atlas Road. The first sediment barriers went up this year with much more, including bridge replacement to follow. I've never said I am against the mine. In fact, I have engaged Riversdale many times directly with the tact that if we are going mining, we are not going poisoning too. Tech provides an excellent example on how to work towards doing this right. That said, they will be in court on October 29, 2015 in Fernie to face charges regarding a very similar event. So now where were we, oh ya, shame on you. You sound like a quadder defending the damage they do by pointing the finger at others or another fellow most of us have come to love. Scandal? Oh look, a terrorist! I should have listened harder to G. B Shaw before I allowed this to raise my blood pressure. I know the area very well and thought I had missed something in the discussion about this issue , I see it's just different folks looking at it differently. I won't waste any more of your time with this discussion. Sorry to increase your blood pressure, good luck finding volunteers for your projects. Quote
WinstonConfluentus Posted September 17, 2015 Posted September 17, 2015 Actions speak louder than words; that said, its' been a very stressful week in the Crowsnest Valley and I wish my words had been gentler. Perhaps this forum was not the right place to seek support for the welfare of the fishery. Quote
danhunt Posted September 17, 2015 Posted September 17, 2015 Perhaps this is obvious and I'm just thicker than two short planks, but what exactly is the issue here? What is in the material from the tailings and how is it going to affect the stream? I can see some dark sediment in the slower areas, but compared to some other waters I've fished it still looks pretty good on the surface. Quote
dryfly Posted September 18, 2015 Posted September 18, 2015 As I know nothing of the specific details about this specific rainstorm (and how it was somehow different than the hundreds of other rainstorms and that something may or may not be different now), I've nothing to say about the facts behind this. That's for experts to decide. But the comment was made, "Perhaps this forum was not the right place to seek support for the welfare of the fishery." Here's a word of advice about getting support for a fisheries issue on this or any forum: start with a rational title instead of some sensational statement as was used: The Biggest Canadian Environmental Disaster If you start with a nonsense title like this, then support for your cause and concern will be hard to find. Lots of folks are fed up with eco sensationalism which fills our media these days. Maybe the actual story is indeed factual, but the title is certainly not. It is not that anyone here is not concerned about "welfare of fisheries." Folks are just sick and tired of eco bullshit which the title is. I make no apologies for being blunt. Regards, Clive PS: I guess since I am already banned, this is unlikely for me to get out on parole in the near future. 3 Quote
lad Posted September 18, 2015 Posted September 18, 2015 Actions speak louder than words; that said, its' been a very stressful week in the Crowsnest Valley and I wish my words had been gentler. Perhaps this forum was not the right place to seek support for the welfare of the fishery. You are getting frustrated because people are not lining up behind you for your imaginary cause. Your words do not need to be gentler there needs to be less of them or think more before typing and using a tragic event as excuse is beyond lame. 1 Quote
WinstonConfluentus Posted September 19, 2015 Posted September 19, 2015 I like bluntness myself Clive and lad, this is far from imaginary and there is nothing lame about bringing it to light. As far as the title goes, I do understand the point made about sensationalism and it's capacity to put folks to sleep eventually, but I feel in this case the qualifier used at the end suggests a different intent. This happened in mid-July and it has somehow remained in the background while lesser events have been reported on. This event, and another which took place in November 2014, are now posted on the Alberta Energy Regulator's Compliance Dashboard for all to see. As well, there is an article by Duane Radford in this month's Alberta Outdoorsman. I trust more will follow as the investigation unfolds. Regarding why this is bad, the two main issues as I understand them are heavy metals, specifically selenium, and the abrasive nature of coal as it fractures down. There are others, and yes we could argue degrees and thresholds all day, but that is the work of scientists and investigators and does not serve the fish's needs when all agree the problems are real and demonstrable.Selenium, primarily a problem in disturbed lands especially coal mines, poses an issue due to the narrow range between what is required for life and what is toxic to life. In trout, it has been proven to reduce reproductive success, be a causative factor in birth defects and reduces survival rates of those that persist past the larval stage. Coal fractures to a sharp edge and this increases the abrasiveness and turbidity of the water leading to mechanical injury to the gills. There are significant other effects of entraining coal and other substances into a fish-bearing watercourse, but I think the above is more than enough to prompt a protective response. So let's talk about this gang; then it will just be another environmental disaster that people I are talking about and maybe something will get done about it. Quote
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