ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Seriously, I'm not trying to start anything with this post, I'm just curious... *The caveat being I know there is no legislation/regulation in Alberta related to the fishing guide industry, so technically none are required... How many guides on here (independant, working through a shop [FFC sponsors or otherwise], etc.) have a business license and/or insurance, 1st aid training, swift water rescue, any or all?! Or would you even be willing to answer?! Other then asking, how does one find out?! Or is asking the only way (if so how does one confirm that they actually do)? P P.S. It will be interesting to see if I actually get any responses from any guides (other then quite possibly a few strongly worded PMs)... Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Other then asking, how does one find out?! Or is asking the only way (if so how does one confirm that they actually do)? You would have to ask; and the company/guide would be able to confirm with documentation if necessary. You wouldn't be able to access the companies/guides personal business info because of FOIP. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 I would also think that if a guide was working through a fly shop, the shop would require it for liability (as well as reputation) reasons... But never assume, I guess!! You would have to ask; and the company/guide would be able to confirm with documentation if necessary. You wouldn't be able to access the companies/guides personal business info because of FOIP. Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 I would also think that if a guide was working through a fly shop, the shop would require it for liability (as well as reputation) reasons... But never assume, I guess!! I don't know an Outfitter in this area (ie. Fly Shop) that doesn't have insurance etc. Quote
Jayhad Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 If I was hiring a guide I wouldn't be that concerned, if the guide is professional then they'll have their bases covered. Peter say you hire guide A, he has everything you listed, and I hire guide B, he is a hack. Let's say both of us are pretty weak casters and new to being in boats. We both leave our gear scattered around the knee brace and both happen to slip on a misplaced fly box, go over and we crack our heads on a rock and die. At this time from our points of view does it really matter if guide B is unprotected? Would those documents prevented you from falling in? Perhaps guide A would have pulled your body out sooner. Regardless, the reason for a guide to have said requires is to protect themselves, not the user if this situation should ever happen. Ill say this, you would be crazy to leverage all you own now and in the future to some yank that fell out of your boat because he went a little to hard the night before. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 Jay, I would also think that if a guide is guiding anglers through the city section of the Bow and doesn't require his clients to wear a life jacket/pfd and the client drowns, that the guide would be liable b/c city ordinence requires river users to wear life jackets/pfds?! And good luck collecting on any law suit if the guide doesn't have liability insurance, right.... I'm sure there are a million scenarios... P If I was hiring a guide I wouldn't be that concerned, if the guide is professional then they'll have their bases covered. Peter say you hire guide A, he has everything you listed, and I hire guide B, he is a hack. Let's say both of us are pretty weak casters and new to being in boats. We both leave our gear scattered around the knee brace and both happen to slip on a misplaced fly box, go over and we crack our heads on a rock and die. At this time from our points of view does it really matter if guide B is unprotected? Would those documents prevented you from falling in? Perhaps guide A would have pulled your body out sooner. Regardless, the reason for a guide to have said requires is to protect themselves, not the user if this situation should ever happen. Ill say this, you would be crazy to leverage all you own now and in the future to some yank that fell out of your boat because he went a little to hard the night before. Quote
Jayhad Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 I would also think that if a guide is guding anglers through the city section of the Bow and doesn't require his clients to wear a life jacket/pfd and the client drowns, that the guide would be liable b/c city ordinence requires river users to wear life jackets/pfds?!P I totally agree as well I've wondered who would receive the ticket? The police boat is relentless up there. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 The shop would, but would the guide (many are independant and contracting through the shop, no?!)? I don't know an Outfitter in this area (ie. Fly Shop) that doesn't have insurance etc. Quote
Guest Wrecker Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 These are the questions you would ask when you are about to book a float trip. I also gotta wonder what the fascination is on this board with guides and how they conduct their business? If your not trying to stir the shiz why don't you PM the known guides on this board and ask them? Same could be done with a phone call to the shops if you were going to book a trip, and again, not just trying to stir the shiz... Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 Yup already done that (only heard back from one), but would think legitmate guides woud like to advertise these facts... An advantage over the competition, no?! P These are the questions you would ask when you are about to book a float trip. I also gotta wonder what the fascination is on this board with guides and how they conduct their business? If your not trying to stir the shiz why don't you PM the known guides on this board and ask them? Same could be done with a phone call to the shops if you were going to book a trip, and again, not just trying to stir the shiz... Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 The shop would, but would the guide (many are independant and contracting through the shop, no?!)? Why would a shop or outfitter have insurance on their guided trips if it didn't cover their contracted guides? Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Yup already done that (only heard back from one), but would think legitmate guides woud like to advertise these facts... An advantage over the competition, no?! P I guess it's an advantage.....if your clients are paranoid. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 Why only if they are paranoid?! Would you hire a ghost cab to drive you to the airport or drive you home from the bar at night?! I guess it's an advantage.....if your clients are paranoid. Quote
Guest NamasteMushroom Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Why only if they are paranoid?! Would you hire a ghost cab to drive you to the airport or drive you home from the bar at night?! Case closed. No point debating extreme unrealistic non-issues. I wouldn't take you down the river anyway. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 I wouldn 't go if you offered! Case closed. No point debating extreme unrealistic non-issues. I wouldn't take you down the river anyway. Quote
Guest Wrecker Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Sort of Let me guess, you work for the government.. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 Keep guessing Let me guess, you work for the government.. Quote
Guest Wrecker Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Keep guessing Sorry, employed by the government... Ha! Getting this back on topic; what did the fly shops say to your query? Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 No fly shops yet, but one part-time guide (he says has everything except swift water rescue)... Getting this back on topic; what did the fly shops say to your query? Quote
Hawgstoppah Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 I carried insurance when I worked with my own company. I never did ask about it when I worked for another outfit last year, I just assumed. Probably not the wisest thing on my part, I'll admit. Quote
Guest Wrecker Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 When it comes to liability, shiz flows downhill. If an incident were to occur and a lawsuit followed the shop that hosted the trip would obviously be named in the legal proceeding. If the guide was a contractor, you bet he would be named in a suit as well. Oh- and when it comes to having your own "insurance"; if you were found "liable" and a catastrophic event occurred directly because of your neglect or lack of training your insurance likely wouldn't have have enough liability coverage to pay the costs. Food for thought. Quote
Hawgstoppah Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 When it comes to liability, shiz flows downhill. If an incident were to occur and a lawsuit followed the shop that hosted the trip would obviously be named in the legal proceeding. If the guide was a contractor, you bet he would be named in a suit as well. Oh- and when it comes to having your own "insurance"; if you were found "liable" and a catastrophic event occurred directly because of your neglect or lack of training your insurance likely wouldn't have have enough liability coverage to pay the costs. Food for thought. True. I was told this a few times, that even a detailed waiver form wasn't going to stop that if it ever did happen. I used to use a waiver my lawyer drafted up that basically said so much as even by direct neglect on my part, I was still not liable. Neglect is such an open ended word. Quote
ÜberFly Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 I heard back from one shop. They carry liability insurance for their guides and require 1st aid. One of theirs has swift water rescue but the was from a previous life. Some of their corporate clients require specific certifications in order for them to do business with them and that is quite common for that type of industry. I totally understand what you are saying about waivers. P Quote
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