oltimer Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Hi rianbowhunter, Since you quoted me, I guess I will respond to some of your questions. " i would just like to know, how many of you people who are with banning camping and quading have ever camped over night , to go fish?? or ever camped in general" I have camped/fished for the last 30+ years all over the eastern slopes, mostly in provincial campgrounds, some random camping about 20 years ago.I have been atving/camping for the last 15years. Nobody wants to ban camping, they just want something done about the squatters that leave there trailer in one random campsite for the entire summer. I think there needs to be rules about how long you can stay in one spot or at least enforce the rules that already exist. " and when we quad, because i fish the river and love them i do my best to not corss them" You stay out of the creeks as much as possible, that's great, but many people do not and even if there is a bridge, some go around just so they can drive in the creek. Alot of quadders are not fishermen and do not think about their impact. "The small amount of damage that the quads do to the trail is minimal compared to the hundreds of logging roads built, and i would like to know how random "camping" only, not quading or anything else just camping efects the fishing in the rivers??? The poeple who camp in the dutch creek area are very responsible rider and campers that keep thier composure and do not go rampid and ruine the enviorment!!" That may be for the Dutch creek area, I have not been there lately, but I have seen many other area's where that is not the case. I have seen area's where the creeks/rivers run like chocolate milk on weekends(especially long weekends) and clear after the weekend is over, due to stupid people running in the creeks/rivers.I do agree that on certain trails, atvs have a limited/manageable impact, but alot of people don't stay on trails or out of creeks or muskeg fields etc etc The random camping thing really doesn't affect the fishing it is more of the squatter problem mentioned above, provided they don't dump waste in or close to the water. " Maybe just a suggestion, if the "quad squad" built bridges or banned river crossings with quads all river damage , ( which is minimal) would be stopped!! " The Quad Squad has no authority to ban anything, as far as the building of bridges, they are doing as many projects as they can, time and funding permiting. " i have personal expieirience" So do many of the people on this board. We are trying to make it so that there will still be something to experience 20-30 years from now. The random camping and atv use may be ok in some areas, but I have seen so many areas from Rocky Mountain House to the Crowsnest pass that are just a mess and need something done now, not later. Lance Sorry Smitty, no letter or even a paragraph yet..... :$*%&:...do past letters count? Ban this ban that We must be careful what we wish for. What kind of world do we want to live in First of all lets define random camping. If random camping is defined as all camping that is not within a designated camp ground then how do we deal with the numerous outfitters who set up camps throughout the province during the hunting season. I have lived all my life in this province and have been random camping( largly because its nice to have family together) for many of those years and have a tough time seeing the coralation between random camping and the decline in the fisheries.Perhaps the decline could be due to the many outfitters with their out of country clients which is basicly doubling the amount of fishermen with every trip they take, or maybe it is the BC guides advertising to their clients to come and fish the great streams of Alberta. Or possibly due to the increase in logging activity in the area. I do not have any answers for this problem but another ban is this democratic siciety is not the answer So ``becareful what we wish for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harps Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 The small amount of damage that the quads do to the trail is minimal compared to the hundreds of logging roads built, and i would like to know how random "camping" only, not quading or anything else just camping efects the fishing in the rivers??? The poeple who camp in the dutch creek area are very responsible rider and campers that keep thier composure and do not go rampid and ruine the enviorment!! Since ive been camping in the Dutch creek area i can go out a 10 at night and not hear a wuad or anything, just maybe a couple of laughs around the fire!!! I have seen a number of RV's that dump their waste water over the banks. I have seen spilled gas from refilling machinery at each site. I have seen rutted up trails in and out of each site that run mud to the creeks when it rains. I have seen litterally tons of garbage left behind. Kids flying down the roads on too big of quads with no helmuts. People tearing up wetlands for the fun of it (destroying long-toed salamander habitat) and wreaking the filtering capabilities of those wetlands. And the sound of generators running all night... I'm sure most people are responsible or ignorant of the damage they do, but that doesn't change tha fact that there are too many people using the area for a playground to not have rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryH Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 .............I'm sure most people are responsible or ignorant of the damage they do, but that doesn't change tha fact that there are too many people using the area for a playground to not have rules. This pretty well sums it up for me -- too many people doing things that are harmful to the wilderness environment. It is not sustainable and we all better accept that what might have worked in the past isn't acceptable anymore. Bring on the rules, and fast. Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanbritt Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Data has actually been collected on this topic and is in the hands of the govt., they just elect not to do anything about it-likely due to the lobbyist pressure from quadding groups. My wife did here Master's thesis on planning for recreational use in the area of the Liv. In addition to doing fieldwork and "mapping" the recreational use and other impacts of the area, she also conducted a user survey in the Liv that included quadders, fly-fisherman, campers, horseback riders, etc. The overwhelming majority of individuals surveyed are IN FAVOR of a recreational plan for the area that would limit areas for motorized recreation and random camping, in order to preserve the resource for future generations. A copy of this work is with the govt. It comes down to who yells the loudest, who has the most money, and who has the most friends in govt. Look at the grizzly bear hunt as a prim example. It took the animal's population to reach near extinction in AB for the hunt to be suspended-due to lobbying by hunting groups. Perhaps we need our fisheries to be fully decimated for anything to happen and for anyone to listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebc Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Point #1. Drive by racehorse + dutch creek campground most of this summer they're nearly empty. Drive 3km up the road and there's 40 or 50 RV's camped within that 3KM. It's not the campgrounds or the capacity of them, though if we can get a random camping ban yes, indeed there would have to be some increased capacity put in. Point #2. If C&R mortality IS having an impact... I agree... we should put down the rods and leave the area alone for 5 years (as my original post stated). I honestly dont think C&R mort is having a huge impact. Creeks with no one around for miles now, have no fish. Even little know less pressured streams anywhere in the catsle / oldman drainage are suffering, from lack of suitable spawning habitat. Go have a look 2km east of the FTR on hwy 532 (towards bear pond and the pass). See that meadow? Ruined. Used to be important spawning grounds for L River cutts. You folks saying this in point #2 have not seen the issues created when access is restricted to the public. . . an unused resource has no clout at all when it comes to protection from development by industry. You might think it is a good thing until yourselves and everyone else has forgotten there were values there that are long gone. I have witnessed this happen in many parts of BC and also in Alberta, and it is decidedly bad advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harps Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 You folks saying this in point #2 have not seen the issues created when access is restricted to the public. . . an unused resource has no clout at all when it comes to protection from development by industry. You might think it is a good thing until yourselves and everyone else has forgotten there were values there that are long gone. I have witnessed this happen in many parts of BC and also in Alberta, and it is decidedly bad advice. Access limited in Alberta!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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